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A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

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Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#11

Post by wpowiertowski »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9
spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

Being Polish makes me very proud of the bravery of Witold Pilecki at the same time Russian army did some horrible things during the „saving” of eastern Europe. However if you look at the numbers they also paid the ultimate price in number of casualties: https://vimeo.com/128373915

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#12

Post by badpun »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9
spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

> The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them.

That is under a big assumption that Stalin's USSR was actually better than Hitler's Germany. Since there were lots of people who fled Soviet-occupied parts of Poland into German-occupied ones (hoping that life under Hitler will be less of a horror), this is not really clear whether the cure was not worse than the disease.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#13

Post by billfruit »

spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

We should also be remembering that large number of Russians suffered in the Holocaust, by some accounts more Soviet citizens were killed in the Holocaust than Jews.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#14

Post by perl4ever »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9
spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

I recently learned something interesting - the gas van was apparently invented in the Soviet Union in the late 30s, shortly before the Nazis started using similar execution methods.

Google Translate says "...he was following the instructions of the NKVD Ministry of Defense and that without them it would be impossible to perform so much the number of executions to which the arrested were sentenced by three threes at a time"

See: https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/1265324

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#15

Post by ferkad »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9
spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

Just do not forget they joined Germany in the invasion of Poland in September 1939. Only because of the termination of Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact by Nazies Soviets were forced to fight them.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#16

Post by ransom1538 »

spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

When Americans arrived in Berlin they were quite horrified. Over 100,000 women in Berlin were systemically raped by Russian soliders [i]. As an American/Englishmen witnessing this and ordered not to intervene created hate and disdain for the Russian forces. The American forces had no concept of what the Russian forces endured -- still not an excuse for rape. Eventually generals on the western side began forming plans to unite with pow German soldiers and start attacking the Russians -- it was such a secret plan it wasn't even disclosed until 1998. [ii] It is hard to visualize the attitude of the American top brass towards Russia in 1945 but I feel this is a fair representation of Patton: [iii].

[i] http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-32529679

[ii]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unthinkable

[iii] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxAIE9TbGyk

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#17

Post by masklinn »

spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

> It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII.

Why? The US were were the last major country to recognise the USSR (in late 1933, just before the USSR joined the LoN), and the USSR's various stated purposes (collectivisation, state atheism, …) were very much polar opposites to the US's.

The alliance was against Nazi Germany, not for anything.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#18

Post by pmyteh »

badpun wrote: post #12
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

> The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. That is under a big assumption that Stalin's USSR was actually better than Hitler's Germany. Since there were lots of people who fled Soviet-occupied parts of Poland into German-occupied ones (ho…

It was unambiguously better if you lived in Great Britain or other places which were at war with Germany but not occupied post-war by the Soviets.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#20

Post by olavk »

badpun wrote: post #12
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

> The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. That is under a big assumption that Stalin's USSR was actually better than Hitler's Germany. Since there were lots of people who fled Soviet-occupied parts of Poland into German-occupied ones (ho…

It would very much depends on who you were. If you had German ancestry you would be better off under the Germans, if you were Jewish you were far worse off. A lot of people in the former USSR occupied areas like the Baltics or Ukraine actually greeted the Germans as liberators, but they quickly changed their mind when they realized the Germans considered Slavs subhumans.
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