After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea • Hacker News Board

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#411

Post by vinay427 » Tue, Jan 30, 2018, 12:28 AM UTC

rsynnott wrote: post #242

vinay427 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention, there are plenty of safer viable alternatives. Is ibuprofen or acetaminophen as effective at preventing pain as oxycodone for most people? Probably not, but they're good enough for most wisdom teeth extractions, a common operation that unfortunately results in many opioid addictions. I had some particularly difficult extractions so I took some ibuprofen for a few weeks to make eating manageable, but a…

Do dentists in the US actually give out opioid painkillers for wisdom teeth extraction?

For what it's worth, I was prescribed the oxycodone-acetaminophen combination last month for an extraction of my four wisdom teeth in the US. My extractions were apparently some of the hardest in the surgeon's 30 years, so I'm not sure if this is the norm.

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#412

Post by spraak » Tue, Jan 30, 2018, 2:11 AM UTC

spraak wrote: post #100

Very sad to remove the uterus, it's the center of the universe in its way. Life comes forth from there, having originated from spiritual realm.

If anyone is still reading this, I'm very curious why this would be downvoted.

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#413

Post by sushimonster123 » Tue, Jan 30, 2018, 2:38 AM UTC

oxide wrote: post #335

underwater wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compared to where? I found US doctors much more likely to prescribe them than Australian doctors.

The undertreatment of pain in the US is affecting my grandparents in a huge way. My poor grandfather spends a week or more a month suffering from the rapid taper the doc is putting him through. We are trying to get him into pain management, apparently every doc in CA is scared of prosecution. The irony is he would be just fine if they never rescheduled hydrocodone. When they did thst he had to be put on fentanyl and…

Highly controversial statement: you can still get Kratom legally online and in some states. There is an opiode like effect. It's worth looking into if your grandfather is suffering.

*edit: didn't see the comment right below this one! Thats +2 for Kratom!

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#414

Post by Lordarminius » Tue, Jan 30, 2018, 8:00 AM UTC

snotrockets wrote: post #406

Lordarminius wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a practicing doctor and I don't know where this is coming from. Paracetamol and Ibuprofen while they have potentially lethal side effects are incredibly safe and effective in daily practice and consequently are very widely used. Every known drug has side effects and if you ever read a drug insert you would never pop a pill again. In the case of ibuprofen/paracetamol we are careful to avoid use in patients with u…

would you recommend a patient take any drugs regularly without regular follow ups? that's the danger of 1000ct over-the-counter. taking a couple of ibuprofens when you have a headache is one thing. taking enough to need 100s of them, without a professional recommendation is another.

No I would not.

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#415

Post by cyborgx7 » Tue, Jan 30, 2018, 9:51 PM UTC

BLKNSLVR wrote: post #277

The article abruptly ended without its appropriate summation commentary on the cultural dependence on drugs inherent, normalised, and seemingly encouraged, in the US. Admitting taking ibuprofen like candy? Even as a joke, it would only be funny where such behaviour isn't too far from normal. No wonder your pain threshold is low.

It told you a story and let you draw your own conclusion. Why do you need someone else to tell you what to think?

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#416

Post by pkilgore » Tue, Jan 30, 2018, 11:38 PM UTC

ams6110 wrote: post #123

pkilgore wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hows that? It's my understanding that in a single payer system you are still allowed to pay for whatever you want or buy supplemental insurance to cover types of care the baseline single payer system will not.

I don't think this is the popular understanding of "single payer" by its advocates in the USA. They think it means "I get any medical care I want, any time, with no waiting, for free."

That's a patently ridiculous straw man. No single payer system in the world operates that way.

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#417

Post by aksx » Wed, Jan 31, 2018, 6:09 AM UTC

clwk wrote: post #294

jjeaff wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if that doctor has ever had major surgery himself and been told not to use painkillers? Even if that is the case, pain seems to vary greatly in how it affects people. I would be very hesitant to tell someone that they should just let the pain "guide" them, because I have no idea what it is like for them.

I have a very relevant anecdote: My grandfather was an open-heart surgeon. In the days following surgery, he would always insist that his patients get up and take a short walk. They would not want to, but he insisted that this was an important and valuable part of recovery (in several dimension) and that they needed to push past resistance and force themselves to do it. Later in life, he underwent a surgery requiring…

Do as the docs says not as the doctor does.

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#418

Post by jjeaff » Wed, Jan 31, 2018, 8:49 AM UTC

vanderZwan wrote: post #167

jjeaff wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if that doctor has ever had major surgery himself and been told not to use painkillers? Even if that is the case, pain seems to vary greatly in how it affects people. I would be very hesitant to tell someone that they should just let the pain "guide" them, because I have no idea what it is like for them.

> I wonder if that doctor has ever had major surgery himself and been told not to use painkillers? Since when is that a requirement for knowing what is best for your patients? The doctor is basing their judgement on current consensus within their field, which hopefully involves careful studies.

Since the world stopped being completely black and white. (It never was.) And most definitely, medical science is not either.

With every medical decision there are trade-offs. Sure, it's best to walk soon after surgery... sometimes. Sometimes it's too early. And sometimes there are trade-offs like torturous pain that no person should have to bear. Many people might choose to forgo the day after walk knowing that their chances of a full recovery might be 0.01% lower.

It reminds me of the mantra that "breast feeding is best". Yes, according to some studies, there appears to be positive relationship. But what if continuing to breast feed causes a mother to stay clinically depressed. What if she can't handle the every 2 hours and it is driving her crazy and she wants to shake her crying baby. Maybe in this case, "formula is best".

A good medical practitioner works with their patients to communicate the risks and rewards clearly and help guide them to make the decisions that work best for them.

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#419

Post by jjeaff » Wed, Jan 31, 2018, 8:55 AM UTC

dangerbird2 wrote: post #408

arbie wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I strongly prefer 5 to 10 somewhat inconvenient minutes over having a numb jaw for a whole day. Is it possible only a minority would consider the pain of a drill into the core of their tooth an inconvenience?

It depends on the procedure. I had a minor cavity filled when I was younger, and it really wasn't all that horrible. Something like a root canal would be unimaginable.

As I mentioned higher up the thread, pain thresholds vary dramatically. My father has had more than one root canal with no anesthetic because it was cheaper. He said the pain wasn't that bad. He just has a very high threshold for tooth pain, or lack of nerves there.

Re: After Surgery in Germany, I Wanted Vicodin, Not Herbal Tea

#420

Post by jjeaff » Wed, Jan 31, 2018, 8:57 AM UTC

bluntfang wrote: post #305

jjeaff wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if that doctor has ever had major surgery himself and been told not to use painkillers? Even if that is the case, pain seems to vary greatly in how it affects people. I would be very hesitant to tell someone that they should just let the pain "guide" them, because I have no idea what it is like for them.

>I would be very hesitant to tell someone that they should just let the pain "guide" them, because I have no idea what it is like for them. You should be hesitant, unless you're a doctor.

As if all doctors make correct decisions all the time. Doctor's should be hesitant as well.