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Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

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Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#1

Post by dizzystar »

I was contacted about a remote position today. They asked for my expected rate and I told them. They replied, "Can you consider coming down since this is a remote position?"

I really struggled to come up with a response to this. Yes, I'm willing to negotiate on principal, but it has nothing to do with being remote. In fact, I consider remote a reason to pay more money.

My thinking is that it's difficult to find the type of people who has the focus and skills (focus overrides skill, I think) to really do remote work well. The employer is not paying for the office, not giving me free coffee, not paying for the computer I'm using, and (if it's important) no ping pong, and no social interaction with coworkers. In return, I give full-on focused work with no cruft.

I understand that it is a trade off, but I'm never sold on the thought that remote is some exclusive benefit.

Re: Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#2

Post by iamdave »

No. These days I consider it a requirement. Doesn't have to be full remote, but I want at minimum 2 days to be able to be out of the office and enjoying from the house I'm paying for using the salary you're (employer, not you, OP) are paying for. Have spent the last couple of weeks embroiled with an engineer who has made my Ops team almost 4 months behind on a specific deliverable.

Meanwhile, the rest of our deliverables that didn't involve this engineer and his team have shipped 90% ahead of time. That 10% was one deliverable that wasn't shipped ahead of time, it was shipped on time.

And my dept. is 100% remote.

I like your arguments though, working remotely sacrifices a lot that you would otherwise get by being chained to a desk, and the idea that you should take LESS money because of it is offensive.

Re: Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#4

Post by grawprog »

I've worked entirely from home before and I didn't really like it after a while. It was too hard to get motivated every day and keep to the schedule I'd set and I missed having coworkers even just being around even if we don't talk all the time. But I would enjoy being able to work from home while still having a workplace I needed to go to at leaat a few days a week.

Re: Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#5

Post by dizzystar »

agitator wrote: post #3

Maybe they feel like you will be saving money and time not having to commute? I don't know. You make valid points and I agree, they shouldn't use remote as leverage when they are already saving a lot on the position being remote.

The gas is valid if they only want to negotiate $3/hr or something like that. It's always more, of course.

Re: Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#6

Post by ams6110 »

grawprog wrote: post #4

I've worked entirely from home before and I didn't really like it after a while. It was too hard to get motivated every day and keep to the schedule I'd set and I missed having coworkers even just being around even if we don't talk all the time. But I would enjoy being able to work from home while still having a workplace I needed to go to at leaat a few days a week.

Where I work, "working from home" is code for "checking email a few times during the day so it appears I'm at least somewhat engaged, while really doing very little at all yet not using a PTO day."

Too hard to get anything done when others you need to collaborate with are not there.

Re: Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#7

Post by seanmcdirmid »

dizzystar wrote: post #5
agitator wrote: post #3

Maybe they feel like you will be saving money and time not having to commute? I don't know. You make valid points and I agree, they shouldn't use remote as leverage when they are already saving a lot on the position being remote.

The gas is valid if they only want to negotiate $3/hr or something like that. It's always more, of course.

Commuting cost time also. If your rate is $80/hour, that really adds up if you have a one hour commute each way with traffic.

Re: Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#8

Post by dizzystar »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #7
dizzystar wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gas is valid if they only want to negotiate $3/hr or something like that. It's always more, of course.

Commuting cost time also. If your rate is $80/hour, that really adds up if you have a one hour commute each way with traffic.

I live in Los Angeles. If the company is in New York, does that mean I should take out the price of plane tickets for each way?

Re: Ask HN: Do You Consider Remote a Working Perk?

#9

Post by Myrmornis »

ams6110 wrote: post #6
grawprog wrote: post #4

I've worked entirely from home before and I didn't really like it after a while. It was too hard to get motivated every day and keep to the schedule I'd set and I missed having coworkers even just being around even if we don't talk all the time. But I would enjoy being able to work from home while still having a workplace I needed to go to at leaat a few days a week.

Where I work, "working from home" is code for "checking email a few times during the day so it appears I'm at least somewhat engaged, while really doing very little at all yet not using a PTO day." Too hard to get anything done when others you need to collaborate with are not there.

Yes, it only works (from the employers point of view) if the following are true:

1. the employee either genuinely enjoys the work or genuinely cares about the company

2. the employee has not become cynical about the company, even if (1) was originally true.

In most lines of work these are unlikely to be true for most people. However, software engineering can, if you're lucky, have an addictive quality and be intellectually enjoyable and intellectually meaningful. If that coincides with a decent company with decent people, then weirdly, remote working can result in people working hard away from the office. In my case, getting much more done away from the office because personally I can get nothing done in an open plan office with frequent meetings.

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