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Developer Skills Report

research.hackerrank.com

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Re: Developer Skills Report

#101

Post by expertentipp »

scarface74 wrote: post #99
expertentipp wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire market being low cost, or at the bottom of corporate outsourcing chain. Market rates == they have higher recruitment requirements than in developed markets where there are higher wages.

I'm still trying to parse that. If the market in question is paying low wages for the industry, that is the market rate. The entire market can't pay below market rate. Are you sure that the rate is below market or are you just looking at the inflated rates of the west coast in the U.S.? I don't live on the west coast, I live in a major metropolitan area in the south, with good wages for developers (90-140K with exper…

How about developing EU country with wages 25-35K? Doing project exclusively for German/British/American markets, where one would have to pay developers locally at least twice... and no, the life is not that much cheaper over here.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#102

Post by onion2k »

collyw wrote: post #91
onion2k wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd argue pointless whiteboard trivia doesn't give you good insight into an applicant, either. And yet, 90% of companies do it. The fact that some companies use bad practises for hiring doesn't change how hard it is to judge someone's code from their Github repo. I agree that whiteboard tests are horrible, but switching to a different bad idea wouldn't help. Unless you're looking at a toy or unfinished project, most…

"As he says himself, Homebrew is a successful product but not necessarily great computer science. He 'failed' a computer science question. " Maybe Google is different but I usually need to do computer cine type stuff about one a year.I have used recursion on maybe 4 different occasions in my carreer, but that's the sort of thing that comes up regularly in coding tests. Why not test for things that are actually being…

Some Google engineers work on the sort of problems, and at the sort of scale, where algorithms and the science that drives them actually makes a difference. I don't think it's unreasonable for Google to ask computer science questions in interviews where that's the case.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#103

Post by scarface74 »

expertentipp wrote: post #101
scarface74 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still trying to parse that. If the market in question is paying low wages for the industry, that is the market rate. The entire market can't pay below market rate. Are you sure that the rate is below market or are you just looking at the inflated rates of the west coast in the U.S.? I don't live on the west coast, I live in a major metropolitan area in the south, with good wages for developers (90-140K with exper…

How about developing EU country with wages 25-35K? Doing project exclusively for German/British/American markets, where one would have to pay developers locally at least twice... and no, the life is not that much cheaper over here.

As a US citizen, if I thought one state had lower wages than another state. I would just move to the state where the wages are better. Why can't a citizen of the EU do the same?

Yes, I chose to leave a small town with no real opportunities after graduating.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#104

Post by dagw »

scarface74 wrote: post #99
expertentipp wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire market being low cost, or at the bottom of corporate outsourcing chain. Market rates == they have higher recruitment requirements than in developed markets where there are higher wages.

I'm still trying to parse that. If the market in question is paying low wages for the industry, that is the market rate. The entire market can't pay below market rate. Are you sure that the rate is below market or are you just looking at the inflated rates of the west coast in the U.S.? I don't live on the west coast, I live in a major metropolitan area in the south, with good wages for developers (90-140K with exper…

90-140K

And even that is at least 50% higher than the pre-tax wages of a good developer in Sweden.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#105

Post by expertentipp »

scarface74 wrote: post #103
expertentipp wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about developing EU country with wages 25-35K? Doing project exclusively for German/British/American markets, where one would have to pay developers locally at least twice... and no, the life is not that much cheaper over here.

As a US citizen, if I thought one state had lower wages than another state. I would just move to the state where the wages are better. Why can't a citizen of the EU do the same? Yes, I chose to leave a small town with no real opportunities after graduating.

One can, but there is significant language and cultural barrier, one is paying awfully high social contributions while the person's family stays in a different country. Plus many in developed countries are prejudiced against employees from developing countries ("you have to agree for less, to put your foot in the door and learn our superior ways of doing things" kind of stuff).

Re: Developer Skills Report

#106

Post by expertentipp »

dagw wrote: post #104
scarface74 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still trying to parse that. If the market in question is paying low wages for the industry, that is the market rate. The entire market can't pay below market rate. Are you sure that the rate is below market or are you just looking at the inflated rates of the west coast in the U.S.? I don't live on the west coast, I live in a major metropolitan area in the south, with good wages for developers (90-140K with exper…

90-140K And even that is at least 50% higher than the pre-tax wages of a good developer in Sweden.

Still too much, that's why you nearshore to Czechia, Poland, and Romania.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#107

Post by dagw »

expertentipp wrote: post #106
dagw wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

90-140K And even that is at least 50% higher than the pre-tax wages of a good developer in Sweden.

Still too much, that's why you nearshore to Czechia, Poland, and Romania.

Ukraine seems to be the new go to place in my experience

Re: Developer Skills Report

#108

Post by scarface74 »

dagw wrote: post #104
scarface74 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still trying to parse that. If the market in question is paying low wages for the industry, that is the market rate. The entire market can't pay below market rate. Are you sure that the rate is below market or are you just looking at the inflated rates of the west coast in the U.S.? I don't live on the west coast, I live in a major metropolitan area in the south, with good wages for developers (90-140K with exper…

90-140K And even that is at least 50% higher than the pre-tax wages of a good developer in Sweden.

It's all relative. 100K where I live affords you a nice house, in a decent area of town with good school systems. $170K household income (one developer salary and one person doing basically anything) allows you to easily afford a home in one of the top 25 most affluent counties in the U.S. with plenty of wiggle room in your budget. Our lifestyle wouldn't be the same in the Bay Area.

Also, from what I understand, Sweden has a lot of benefits that we have to pay for in the US (healthcare, post secondary education, paid parental leave, etc.)

Re: Developer Skills Report

#109

Post by scarface74 »

expertentipp wrote: post #105
scarface74 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a US citizen, if I thought one state had lower wages than another state. I would just move to the state where the wages are better. Why can't a citizen of the EU do the same? Yes, I chose to leave a small town with no real opportunities after graduating.

One can, but there is significant language and cultural barrier, one is paying awfully high social contributions while the person's family stays in a different country. Plus many in developed countries are prejudiced against employees from developing countries ("you have to agree for less, to put your foot in the door and learn our superior ways of doing things" kind of stuff).

Still trying to understand. You're a citizen of the EU as is your family. Why leave your family behind?

Not having been to Europe so I don't know, but if you speak English does that help make mobility easier?

Re: Developer Skills Report

#110

Post by expertentipp »

dagw wrote: post #107
expertentipp wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Still too much, that's why you nearshore to Czechia, Poland, and Romania.

Ukraine seems to be the new go to place in my experience

Ukrainians flee like crazy to Czechia, Poland, and Germany. The rates offered in Ukraine are literally a spat in the face, also the country offers almost no social security. It's a sad and dark place to create the software in - corporations love it.
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