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Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

arstechnica.com

81–90 of 219 posts

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#81
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It's (unsurprisingly) pushing the used market up. I'm selling a 1070 I don't need anymore, and it's already at more than I originally paid for it, despite being over a year old at this point.

My local Microcenter has an open-box 1070 they want $800 for, an open-box 1060 3 GB they want $475 for, a couple new 1060 6 GBs they want $600 for, and a couple 1050 Tis they want $350 for. That's their entire stock apart from some misc GTS cards from like 10 years ago. So yeah, they're marking everything up to double MSRP basically.

Strange; Microcenter is blamed for not marking up the AMD Vega56/64 and selling it for MSRP, though reference cards are no longer being produced.

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand most people are wishful to see Cryptocurrencies crash but what if it doesn't? What would happen if Crytpo booms big time?

In terms of graphics cards? Well presumably if cryptos keep driving up demand for an extended period of time, then nVidia will just increase production. Right now they haven't increased production because they think it's a bubble.

>> Right now they haven't increased production because they think it's a bubble.

Much more complicated than that. They haven't increased production because there is a RAM shortage and collusion is suspected. Samsung is the bottleneck, not Nvidia. This is changing as Samsung already announced they will increase production over time as Hynix continues to eat into their profits despite being inferior.

It's not as simple as cryptocurrency-haters would like to make it sound.

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#83

I'm legitimately worried about the long term future of my hobby (PC gaming) at this point. Prices like this have a cascade effect because when less people can afford to build a PC and/or upgrade there's less incentive for developers and publishers to spend time on the platform. Consoles are shielded by the ability of Sony and Microsoft to take losses which will be absorbed by online fees and higher game prices but no…

The 1050 and the 1060 3GB GPUs are more than good enough to run any tier one game on nearly the highest graphics on a 24" monitor. Everything above it is just ridiculousness for the sake of being absurd in the gaming industry, and for benchmarks that don't reflect real usage - unlike GPU mining, where the cards are actually pushed to their maximums.

I have the 1060 6GB. It can max out any game on my 1080p 60hz 24" monitor.

However, that's table stakes these days. 1440p monitors are gaining ground as people realize the DPI difference between their PC monitor and their smartphone. Moreover, most people can also notice the difference between 60hz and 100hz monitors.

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#84

I'm legitimately worried about the long term future of my hobby (PC gaming) at this point. Prices like this have a cascade effect because when less people can afford to build a PC and/or upgrade there's less incentive for developers and publishers to spend time on the platform. Consoles are shielded by the ability of Sony and Microsoft to take losses which will be absorbed by online fees and higher game prices but no…

Long term is not a problem actually, with high demand more factories will be built, but it takes time.

Short-term, we're stuck with high prices.

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#86
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 1050 and the 1060 3GB GPUs are more than good enough to run any tier one game on nearly the highest graphics on a 24" monitor. Everything above it is just ridiculousness for the sake of being absurd in the gaming industry, and for benchmarks that don't reflect real usage - unlike GPU mining, where the cards are actually pushed to their maximums.

I have the 1060 6GB. It can max out any game on my 1080p 60hz 24" monitor. However, that's table stakes these days. 1440p monitors are gaining ground as people realize the DPI difference between their PC monitor and their smartphone. Moreover, most people can also notice the difference between 60hz and 100hz monitors.

So now we're talking about bleeding-edge technology in the 1440p / 100hz realm. I don't feel really bad that gamers can't readily get access to the technologies that drive the 0.0001% of gamers to these settings, no more than I feel bad for cryptocurrency miners who spend $1200 on a 1080ti and configure it like an idiot and get half the earning potential they should.

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#87
post #46
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently learned a really fascinating stuff about semiconductors: as they heat up, the doping atoms tend to move, by diffusion. Heat = more diffusion.

Another fun fact: Chips are designed to last years at full power and max temperature.

It's actually the temperature cycling that's far worse for them.

Plenty of available reading on cryptocurrency mining forums.

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#88
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ASICs aren't saving the planet either - people are incentivized to burn up to $BLOCK_REWARD of electricity per block, the number of hashes it takes to do so is irrelevant. If you come up with a better ASIC, people will buy more of them, the network difficulty increases, and you're back where you started. It's just another stage in the Red Queen's Race. The only thing ASICs do is centralize control (because economies…

A huge amount of the electricity being used was unused/not-competed-for in the first place. Miner farms are coalescing in Northern America around excess production in hydroelectric areas. This is an inconvenient fact that is ignored in the "electricity oh nooooo" debate.

Except excess hydroelectric production is extremely valuable to other utilities on the interconnection who run primarily thermal plants.

Hydro is one of the few forms of baseload power that can be ramped in a hurry: you can increase or decrease production just by increasing or reducing flow through the turbine. If you use less water, it builds up in the reservoir as potential energy and you can use it later.

Compare this to thermal plants, which require many hours to have a significant swing in energy output. I have heard of ramp figures on the order of days for very large nuclear reactors.

Because thermal stations run with pretty flat power output, hydroelectric stations have a critical role smoothing out load conditions, ramping down at night and up during the day. Since electricity is traded on a market system, utilities with significant hydro operations really benefit from this: they can reduce production and import excess capacity from thermal plants at night, and increase production during the day to export at a much higher rate.

This is part of why regions with predominantly hydro power have such low rates: in addition to hydroelectric being pretty cheap once a dam is built, hydro operators make significant amounts of money by appropriate import/export to thermal operators. Since a lot of hydro utilities are state owned (eg: BC Hydro, Hydro Quebec, Bonneville Power Administration), the profits are used to subsidize lower rates for ratepayers.

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#89
post #68
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the mining was to crash hard, it'd be a fantastic time to be a gamer with 2nd market GPU offerings. ;) Also, I bought my own 1080TI last May and have had it mining when PC not in use. It's already earned itself back, potentially speaking (haven't actually sold anything yet for real dollars). A single card isn't enough to bring anything solid in, but it's at least a foot in the door kind of thing, especially for th…

A card used for mining will have worn out fans and potentially damage from heat on it. You'll have to hope for really cheap used cards to make up for that.

I'm running my GPU in mid 50s Celcius, with plenty of case cooling. (Lowered the power target etc.)

Re: Why you can’t buy a high-end graphics card at Best Buy

#90

Funny that in this image in the article: https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/bare_... The entire shelf is sold out of GPUs, but it's a near-lock that the RX550 2GB model for $71.xx had a higher ROI than any single card purchased for cryptocurrency mining. Now, that being said, gamers (and to a lesser extent, deep learning researchers) need to shut up and enjoy a good thing while it lasts. Gamers wh…

That is in my opinion an overly simplistic way of looking at it.

First of all, many people (myself included) would not want to have to burn electricity in order to offset the increased price. Even if you disregard the obvious environmental reasons, people sleeping close to their computers simply do not have the choice of leaving it running 24/7 unless they want to have vivid dreams about vacuum cleaners every night.

Second, even if the higher prices can be evened out in the long run from mining, this forces people to pay more money up-front in both hardware and electricity. Buying gaming equipment suddenly became an investment.

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