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In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

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Re: In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

#41

Post by JoeAltmaier »

rdzah wrote: post #33
moonpolysoft wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Responding to the grandparent's edit. I disagree with your premise that a vesting cliff exists as a "getting to know you" period. It is a guarantee of a minimum investment of time for a given amount of equity. The person put in the required time and now wants to do something else. This is not dishonorable in the least. You seem to be confusing personal relationships with business relationships. This might explain why…

Oh, he's not confusing it at all. He's just so used to being able to take advantage of the average employee being the one confusing the biz & personal that when an employee acts like a businessman, it challenges his entire exploitative hustle.

Agreed. Its business. You give me money, I give you work. Beyond that is all figment of your imagination.

Re: In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

#43

Post by jacquesm »

jnovek wrote: post #11

"The longest was 12 months at [Redacted], and that was only because I wanted my options to vest. I handed them my resignation on my 366th day." This made me livid. I don't hire engineers with the intention of firing them the day before they vest, why would it be ethical to wait until the day after your cliff to quit? [EDIT] Let me clarify. This individual seems to have decided months before that they would quit the d…

If you want a longer vesting cliff you should negotiate one.

Also I'm personally completely against vesting cliffs, much more in favor of a gradually growing stake so that there is no sharp transition like this.

Re: In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

#44

Post by hasenj »

wccrawford wrote: post #21

I've been with the same company almost 5 years now. While I occasionally have times that I'm incredibly frustrated, I can deal with that because I know that I work daily to make things better. (A co-worker would laugh at this because he thinks we don't do enough better-making. He's leaving.) I've seen this company's software turn from 'oh ---- that's crazy' to 'man, this sucks' and it's continuing to get better. Whil…

Things don't have to be perfect from the start, they have to be in such a way that you are free to make things better.

Re: In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

#45

Post by hasenj »

Construct wrote: post #32

Ownership not as a percentage of equity, but as a measure of your ability to change things for the better. In any company it is difficult to find ownership and recognition at the lowest levels of the corporate hierarchy. If you only work for the company for less than a year, as the author proudly admits to, then you should not expect to be given substantial influence in the company. Influence and recognition must be…

> If you're impatient, then you're going to have to work at a startup or start your own company.

I think that's exactly the point of the article.

> the trick is to get engaged and routinely demonstrate that you care

It's hard to care when you don't have ownership. It's impossible to 'demonstrate that you care' when you don't actually care that much.

> If instead you ask your boss about the customer's needs or take the initiative to track down and talk to the sales person in charge of the account for some additional detail, you've effectively taken a small piece of ownership and showed some initiative.

I do that sometimes, but it often falls on deaf ears.

The response is often: yeah the product sucks, our design sucks, but that's how it is, we know that and we're not gonna let you fix it; we need you to work on XYZ instead.

Re: In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

#47

Post by mgkimsal »

cmarv wrote: post #22

Why isn't this person just a consultant? There is nothing wrong with just being a sprinter, but isn't there something to be said for being able to run the marathon? If the spark is gone after only a few months at a company, seemingly no matter what the company, maybe the problem is within and not with the companies that you're working with?

Or maybe there is no 'problem' at all. Different people work in different ways.

Re: In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

#48

Post by mgkimsal »

Construct wrote: post #32

Ownership not as a percentage of equity, but as a measure of your ability to change things for the better. In any company it is difficult to find ownership and recognition at the lowest levels of the corporate hierarchy. If you only work for the company for less than a year, as the author proudly admits to, then you should not expect to be given substantial influence in the company. Influence and recognition must be…

If you only work for the company for less than a year, as the author proudly admits to, then you should not expect to be given substantial influence in the company.

=======================

Explain VPs and midlevel execs that come in and are given substantial influence on day 1. They've not worked at the company, yet are given staff, budgets, division and respoonsibility, sometimes (often?) before it's known if a) they're really competent and b) a good corporate fit.

Seeing that sort of stuff happen can lead people like the OP to despair even more of being able to make any substantive impact.

Re: In Praise of Quitting Your Job, or The New Work Ethic.

#49

Post by trustfundbaby »

Construct wrote: post #32

Ownership not as a percentage of equity, but as a measure of your ability to change things for the better. In any company it is difficult to find ownership and recognition at the lowest levels of the corporate hierarchy. If you only work for the company for less than a year, as the author proudly admits to, then you should not expect to be given substantial influence in the company. Influence and recognition must be…

In any company it is difficult to find ownership and recognition at the lowest levels of the corporate hierarchy. If you only work for the company for less than a year, as the author proudly admits to, then you should not expect to be given substantial influence in the company.

------------------------------------------

Software developer interns at good companies like are routinely given serious work (consequential to the company) to do and left to figure it out largely by themselves, with help available if they need it.

I don't see why it should take a year before anyone would extend that level of respect to a actual employee.

People just want to feel like the work they do matters, and that they aren't micro managed to the finish line.

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