Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

blogs.wsj.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 24 posts

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#11

Post by jseliger »

jasonjei wrote: post #6

Why is it that everyone is so concerned about where to start? Location is important, but having a product out, or at least a prototype available, is more important. You can do this anywhere, and when you get seed money or funding later, you can move to somewhere glamorous. It's like moving to Hollywood because you want to be an actor or writer. If you're the coder--especially if you're the coding founder--you can mak…

Why is it that everyone is so concerned about where to start?

Because where you start appears to influence -- heavily -- where you end up, or if you end up doing anything important. How many big tech companies began and stayed in in Madison, WI, or in Florida? Almost none.

There's a whole field dedicated to examining why and how this happens: economic geography. See here for a decent intro: http://eh.net/encyclopedia/article/patton.carpet . The carpet industry in Georgia is one such example; Internet startups in Silicon Valley are another; movies in L.A. is a third; and so on.

It's like moving to Hollywood because you want to be an actor or writer.

Take a look at William Goldman's Adventures in the Screen Trade, where he says:

"I find Los Angeles a very difficult and potentially dangerous place to work in, and I think anyone seriously contemplating a career as a screenwriter ought to move there as soon as it's humanly or financially possible" {Goldman@74}.

Later:

Screenwriters should go to L.A. despite the problems. As Goldman says, "To begin with the practical: Simply put, they know things out there the rest of the country doesn't, and they get that information first. The movie business is a part of the fabric of life in Los Angeles, and that just isn't true anywhere else. It is, if you will, in the air" {Goldman@80}.

People who ignore this ignore it at their own peril.

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#12

Post by SkyMarshal »

"7) The anti-B.S. factor: Silicon Valley is a town where the tech industry dominates the conversation. In sharp contrast, New York is home to many industries so it’s difficult for an entrepreneur to get caught up in what the investor Fred Wilson calls an “echo-chamber groupthink.” Bottom line — entrepreneurs have to be creative and can’t get caught up in their bubble."

I found this interesting, as my own echo-chamber-group-think radar is sometimes set off by things I hear coming out of the Valley scene. For example, some aspects of social media remind me of the original dotcom boom.

I don't live there though, so what does the HN crowd think about that, especially Valley denizens?

As a side note there are clear exceptions, like Ycominbator's diverse portfolio and wish list (http://ycombinator.com/ideas.html), among others.

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#13

Post by pmjoyce »

Sort of off topic question but does anyone know why the second "t" character in the last paragraph is rendering as a "†" (Dagger, U+2020)? Is this part of a digital watermark or something?

"Matt Mireles, the founder and CEO of †he video transcription service SpeakerText"

edit: spelling

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#14

Post by jasonjei »

jseliger wrote: post #11
jasonjei wrote: post #6

Why is it that everyone is so concerned about where to start? Location is important, but having a product out, or at least a prototype available, is more important. You can do this anywhere, and when you get seed money or funding later, you can move to somewhere glamorous. It's like moving to Hollywood because you want to be an actor or writer. If you're the coder--especially if you're the coding founder--you can mak…

Why is it that everyone is so concerned about where to start? Because where you start appears to influence -- heavily -- where you end up, or if you end up doing anything important. How many big tech companies began and stayed in in Madison, WI, or in Florida? Almost none. There's a whole field dedicated to examining why and how this happens: economic geography. See here for a decent intro: http://eh.net/encyclopedia…

I think many of you are misinterpreting what I'm writing. I'm not discounting the influence of a place like New York or San Francisco--there is much to gain and great products are built in those cities, and your likelihood of success increases. What I am warning is that I hear the stories of founders that move to SF, don't have a product out, live off cash reserves, and months in to the project still no viable product. There are some who seem to believe the inception of any product must begin there.

To the contrary, I actually encourage people to move to SF and NYC because of the knowledge/experience/atmosphere. But you stand to have better chances when you move _prepared_ than when you move to a big city without a plan. Especially a city like NYC where starving, talented artists are a dime a dozen. It's the capital of capitalism.

Moving to a city is a step you make when you are firmly committed to the idea. Don't just move because you have an idea. Have your things in order. It's a lot like fishing--just make sure you have your bait before you go. If you have start worrying about lease, payroll, and so on from the very beginning, well, it'll be tough. But if you have a direction, like a minimal amount of code written already, you'll move into the big city much better prepared. Remember, cities like SF and NYC are capitals of capitalism.

Before you quit you job and move to a big city, be prepared about the gravity of such a decision. You'll need to commit to a lease. NYC leases are not cheap if you aren't already there. You'll need to spend time to setup your office/apartment (often the same). You're likely moving there to hire talent. But if you start a project without a strong beginning, you'll be burning cash--and a lot of it in a big city where wages and cost of living are higher.

There is no doubt about the economic influence of a place. But being in X won't stop you from being successful. As long as you're driven, you will move to Y as long as you have a product and a plan. Just my 2 cents.

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#15

Post by jasonjei »

carterac wrote: post #9
jasonjei wrote: post #6

Why is it that everyone is so concerned about where to start? Location is important, but having a product out, or at least a prototype available, is more important. You can do this anywhere, and when you get seed money or funding later, you can move to somewhere glamorous. It's like moving to Hollywood because you want to be an actor or writer. If you're the coder--especially if you're the coding founder--you can mak…

I disagree. You're not appreciating the values of serendipity, creativity, and culture that you gain from living in an exciting and dense place like NYC. While seemingly intangible, I believe that these qualities lead to more exciting and innovative ideas in the long run. And NYC's dense and supportive startup community makes it more likely that people will connect over these ideas and form teams that would never hav…

Actually, I don't believe I said _not_ to move at all. I said don't move until you're prepared. I'm giving this warning because many founders that I've spoken to only talk about the dream--then they move, and they find out it's not all that peachy.

Cities like NYC and SF have tremendous cultural value and produce awesome products and have tons of talented people. The whole idea of moving is to attract the best and brightest to your team.

Move when you're ready. The city pace moves fast, and so will your project too. If you move about a plan, prototype, or direction, you'll find the difficulty of whatever it is you're trying to accomplish compounded.

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#16

Post by mansilla »

pmjoyce wrote: post #13

Sort of off topic question but does anyone know why the second "t" character in the last paragraph is rendering as a "†" (Dagger, U+2020)? Is this part of a digital watermark or something? "Matt Mireles, the founder and CEO of †he video transcription service SpeakerText" edit: spelling

Hilarious. I was just looking at the same thing and thinking of the Praetorian Pi symbol in that epic film, "The Net"

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#17

Post by jasonjei »

MediaSquirrel wrote: post #3
alexbiz wrote: post #2

One comment...Wall Street doesn't have a choke-hold on technical talent. For instance, most (I'm confident to say above 90%) people recruited by banking programs cannot write a single line of code. Excel macros don't count.

Yeah, i think he misunderstood my point just slightly, which is really that there's not enough serious dev talent that in NYC that actually wants to go into startups. Wall Street is not the only cause, but is a major factor. Ironically, I intro'd that reporter to 60% of the people in the story he quoted, including Carter Cleveland and Cody Brown.

NYC programming talent is centered around enterprisey stuff. Audit trails, triggers, transactions, logs, SOAP, COBOL, messaging platforms/queues, XML, Java, and the like. It's high-talentstuff, but stuff that many in Valley aren't interested.

Start-ups in NYC are increasing. Union Square Ventures is probably a good reason for the push of NYC software startups.

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#18

Post by whakojacko »

SkyMarshal wrote: post #12

"7) The anti-B.S. factor: Silicon Valley is a town where the tech industry dominates the conversation. In sharp contrast, New York is home to many industries so it’s difficult for an entrepreneur to get caught up in what the investor Fred Wilson calls an “echo-chamber groupthink.” Bottom line — entrepreneurs have to be creative and can’t get caught up in their bubble." I found this interesting, as my own echo-chamber…

Firstoff, Silicon Valley isn't a "town."

Secondly, I hate how articles (this one included) talk about new NY startups and how they are so different from ones in the Bay. While there is definitely some degree of truth to that, a lot of their examples focus on companies such as Tumblr and Foursquare, which seem like complete stereotypes of the current SV bubble: Consumer-oriented social platforms that are heavy on TechCrunch posts and light on revenue. Not that the the Bay Area doesn't have lots of those too, but if you want to talk about how "different" the NY startup scene is I think 4Sq is a terrible example. Gilt is a much better example.

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#19

Post by cageface »

MediaSquirrel wrote: post #3
alexbiz wrote: post #2

One comment...Wall Street doesn't have a choke-hold on technical talent. For instance, most (I'm confident to say above 90%) people recruited by banking programs cannot write a single line of code. Excel macros don't count.

Yeah, i think he misunderstood my point just slightly, which is really that there's not enough serious dev talent that in NYC that actually wants to go into startups. Wall Street is not the only cause, but is a major factor. Ironically, I intro'd that reporter to 60% of the people in the story he quoted, including Carter Cleveland and Cody Brown.

I've been keeping an eye on NYC job postings lately with the idea of switching coasts but I haven't seen that many. What are some good ones that currently need people?

Re: Seven Reasons Tech Start-Ups Are Setting Up Shop in New York

#20

Post by rwhitman »

jasonjei wrote: post #6

Why is it that everyone is so concerned about where to start? Location is important, but having a product out, or at least a prototype available, is more important. You can do this anywhere, and when you get seed money or funding later, you can move to somewhere glamorous. It's like moving to Hollywood because you want to be an actor or writer. If you're the coder--especially if you're the coding founder--you can mak…

At first I was going to disagree (having lived in Hollywood for a long time I've actually seen folks 'make it' as attributed to moving to LA), but I get your argument now.

Basically, I agree, you should build your skills and your product wherever you are before you decide to move anywhere. It will be infinitely cheaper.

The Hollywood folks who learned their craft or made their TV pilot before hitting LA are always at a huge advantage over those who move with the dream first..

Post reply on HN