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Two genes in Chromosomes 13 and 14, linked to Homosexuality

nature.com

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Re: Two genes in Chromosomes 13 and 14, linked to Homosexuality

#141

Post by dwaltrip »

8bitsrule wrote: post #140
dwaltrip wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a misreading of Kuhn. He believed in scientific progress -- he says so explicitly.

I was responding to the statement that "We simply focus all of our effort on the things we do not yet understand." Kuhn (short summary) pointed out that paradigms arise which, after a time, cause scientists that have 'bought in' to resist attempts to modify them. Many scientists get 'stuck' in the current paradigm and pooh-pooh attempts to modify them. The history of science demonstrates this over and over ... EG Weg…

Ah I see. My bad, I assumed you were talking about the first part.

Re: Two genes in Chromosomes 13 and 14, linked to Homosexuality

#142

Post by gh02t »

moosinho wrote: post #95
gh02t wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, I don't know if you want to take it quite that far. Your genes might predispose you towards one path or another, but there is still free will involved. Complex sociological events like someone committing a criminal act can't just be reduced to "their genes made them do it." There are other factors involved and they are far more complex than what can be reduced to simple genetics. I think sexual orientation is pro…

It is a common misconception that Chaos theory and Quantum Mechanics show that universe is random. Chaos theory is a perfectly deterministic theory that basically means fragility to initial conditions. Quantum Mechanics, at least in Copenhagen interpretation does imply that the universe is random. But there at least 2 more, perfectly deterministic interpretations that make exactly the same predictions as the non-dete…

Chaos theory doesn't imply randomness, it implies unpredictability. Hyper sensitivity to initial conditions means you can't reliably predict the exact outcome, because it's impossible to observe all the relevant initial conditions accurately enough. I can't, for example, predict the trajectory of a actual double-rod pendulum except at fairly short time intervals even though the governing equations are known, because practically I cannot measure the initial conditions precisely enough. I would argue that even if you could write a master equation to predict human behavior perfectly it'd likely either be so sensitive to initial conditions it'd be useless or have so many initial conditions that you wouldn't be able to determine them all.

I guess I'm not super expert on QM or some of its different interpretations, but from our point of view there's not a whole lot of difference between multiple universes and actual randomness is there?

Re: Two genes in Chromosomes 13 and 14, linked to Homosexuality

#143

Post by yipopov »

mfukar wrote: post #137
yipopov wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but in the context of upholding traditional Christian moral standards that's not an option that's on the table, and neither is using contraception. Celibacy, or to be more precise, abstinence, is the only option.

You're talking about a very specific "Christian" society, which, you should bear in mind, has very few things in common with other Christian societies, like the orthodox for instance.

I know the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox do in fact practice things like abortion and contraception, but they are still highly controversial subjects and far from universally accepted in the hierarchy.

I still think it's a pretty fair generalisation of traditional Christianity and the vast majority of Christians (liberal western Protestants are a minority on the global scale, and even they don't universally accept abortion and contraception, take for instance Pastor Anderson)

Re: Two genes in Chromosomes 13 and 14, linked to Homosexuality

#144

Post by mfukar »

yipopov wrote: post #143
mfukar wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're talking about a very specific "Christian" society, which, you should bear in mind, has very few things in common with other Christian societies, like the orthodox for instance.

I know the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox do in fact practice things like abortion and contraception, but they are still highly controversial subjects and far from universally accepted in the hierarchy. I still think it's a pretty fair generalisation of traditional Christianity and the vast majority of Christians (liberal western Protestants are a minority on the global scale, and even they don't universally accept ab…

Then perhaps I'm biased. Where I was raised (eastern orthodox), preaching in favour of contraception and abortion as divine mandate was/is seen as crazy. I certainly don't have numbers to compare.

Re: Two genes in Chromosomes 13 and 14, linked to Homosexuality

#145

Post by throws990 »

MAGZine wrote: post #44
throws990 wrote: post #18

First critique that immediately comes to mind is how the 1,077 homosexual men and 1,231 heterosexual men were selected. If Republicans have taught us anything, it's that self-reporting is not an accurate measure. From the paper: "classified men as homosexual based on both their self-reported sexual identity and sexual feelings" Furthermore, how does this study explain sexual fluidity? IE: I liked kissing boys when I…

Is this a troll? How do you intend to determine whether or not if someone is of an orientation EXCEPT for asking them? "I'm gay." "Well my 'science test' says that you're not." Nice.

More like:

Researcher: "Excuse me sir, are you gay"?

Senator Larry Craig: "No I just have a very wide stance in public bathrooms"

Re: Two genes in Chromosomes 13 and 14, linked to Homosexuality

#146

Post by woodpanel »

jcelerier wrote: post #102
woodpanel wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hallelujah, with these findings and the advancement of CRISPR, religious re-education camps can step up their game! irony_off While I doubt we'd see these means anytime soon, it could go either way I think: Forced abortions because of sex orientation (and who says that it'll have to be the straight people that abort homosexuals, not the other way around?) or taking a pill and become gay for some months, as you wish.…

> (and who says that it'll have to be the straight people that abort homosexuals, not the other way around?) /me trying to picture two guys having an abortion

Just for clarification of what I've meant: a homosexual majority/elite could equally make it unpopular to come to labor with an heterosexual child.
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