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Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

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201–210 of 371 posts

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#201
post #30

If the threat of regulation drops it 25%, that's not a very good store of value or medium of exchange.

Compared to some currencies, it is. Brazil Real has lost 80% of its value relative to the dollar since 2013. I think this is overdone considered the last time Korea threatened regulation it only fell 10%.

80%? Where did you pull that number from?

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#202

Time to buy. Down from what price since January? Cryptocurrency is a long term play from a software and financial engineering vantage. It also continues to irritate the hell out of banks (bank accounts are being closed and restricted from exchange transfers, including coinbase) and general investors. It's not liquid enough yet, creates no need for middle men and Bitcoin itself is now being manipulated by futures cont…

Yes, but what? Ripple's seen maybe the biggest loss, but it's not clear that part of its loss isn't due to decreasing confidence in the underlying, which is bad if you want to BTFD. Same can be said for many others. Though if you look at todays charts e.g. in ETH, it's clear someone's probably made good money intraday buying dips.

A lot of people don’t understand how ripple works and how the underlying mechanism works, it seems far more useful than bitcoin because of the transaction speed. But I think it is going down because that is the one they went up the most recently, which means the gains are more likely from hype than anything

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#203
post #173

I have been trying to figure out eventual equilibrium price of BitCoin and here is one approach: Due to wealth inequality, we assume that majority of the crypto investment would be from ultra-rich. It might become quite normal for them to invest 1% of their wealth in crypto for uncorrelated diversification. In a way this is very similar to buying art which probably doesn't have much utility except among other wealthy…

That doesn't make any sense. Using this logic you could argue that basically anything should have an eventual market cap of ~$1 trillion.

He's merely talking about upper bound. Which is probably true.

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should Bitcoin cost so much just because the future may depend on it? That's a good case for why it will continue to exist, but it could also exist and do it's job at $1.00 / btc. I think it's a couple of things that Buffett is looking at. First, like gold, Bitcoin is not a business and does not produce earnings. Second, people seem to be buying it for no other reason than that they think it'll keep going up. Tha…

Because the price of any currency is proportional to GDP/velocity, and since it's costly to exchange cryptocurrency with fiat, there's a limit to how high the velocity can go.

> Because the price of any currency is proportional to GDP/velocity

wat

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should Bitcoin cost so much just because the future may depend on it? That's a good case for why it will continue to exist, but it could also exist and do it's job at $1.00 / btc. I think it's a couple of things that Buffett is looking at. First, like gold, Bitcoin is not a business and does not produce earnings. Second, people seem to be buying it for no other reason than that they think it'll keep going up. Tha…

Because the price of any currency is proportional to GDP/velocity, and since it's costly to exchange cryptocurrency with fiat, there's a limit to how high the velocity can go.

The quantity of money is proportional to nominal GDP/velocity (in the quantity theory of money). This doesn't tell you anything about the "price of a currency" in another currency, ie the exchange rate.

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#206

The suicide prevention hotline is pinned to the top of cryptocurrency subreddits because the price of bitcoin is where it was at the beginning of last month. Think about that for a minute. When we really have a bear market people are going to lose their minds.

Naive speculators are buying cryptocurrencies on their credit cards without understanding the volatility https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-01-11/bitcoin-b...

I took out a loan to buy bitcoin. I got a $10k loan in 2013, the loan was paid off in 2015. I have taken out considerably more in profit than I invested and still have most of my bitcoins. Prior to that I had bought bitcoin when it was very cheap ($3-$5) and sold it because I needed money to buy a house, once the house purchase was completed I took out the loan to buy back in. Also, at least here in the UK it is possible to arrange credit card debt to be 0% so not every investor who uses a loan or credit card to purchase btc is naive.

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#207
post #186
post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any successful Lightning Network (at scale) would require a dramatic block size increase. The last (Lightning Network tech) I saw suggested it would need a 133MB blocksize. Blockstream struck down a modest increase to 2MB in November. They have devs who want to reduce the blocksize. I'm not sure where you're finding hope in LN. Bitcoin Cash forked off to get back to scaling, and it's doing great. Check out how well t…

And Bitcoin Cash will need GB or even TB sized blocks to scale to the size of Visa. If scaling the network was as easy as changing 1 variable it wouldn't be that hard to get consensus on a scaling solution.

[deleted]

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#208

This is what happens when you have high correlation and low exchange liquidity . All it takes is 150 coins sold ($1.5 million) to make it fall 1000 points, and then the other exchanges and coins mirror this. If the major exchanges were consolidated there would be much less volatility. http://https://greyenlightenment.com/why-bitcoin-is-so-volat...

Other exchanges will not mirror this--arbitrage will occur

> arbitrage will occur

It already is occurring.

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Naive speculators are buying cryptocurrencies on their credit cards without understanding the volatility https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-01-11/bitcoin-b...

Not true, it's a very savvy move. You're gambling with someone else's money-- credit card debt can be discharged in bankruptcy. You don't lose your house or your shirt, and the only real consequence is poor credit for a few years. And if bitcoin goes up? Pay it off, keep the profits...you still win.

In a bankruptcy that was for personal debt such as credit cards surely your house as an asset can be sold in the event of a bankruptcy?

Re: Bitcoin Fall Extends to 25% as Fears of Crackdown Linger

#210
post #94
post #7

The last time China explicitly banned Bitcoin, it dropped by around 45% to around $6000. It went on to $20K from there. But what's different this time is that there are first time investors in millions who joined in the last 2 months. They didn't read the white paper, they didn't invest in technology, they invested for the monster returns. So I think there will be a more sell off this time before it rebounds back to…

I love bitcoin and cryptocurrency as potential solutions to problems with gov-controlled currencies (I've used crypto to buy drugs, for example). But I'm still confused why people refer to purchasing currency as an "investment." Obviously the rates are going up now, but doesn't everyone expect them to just come back down? I don't convert my USD to Yen and call it an "investment."

Might some argue that some of the capital being placed in these currencies, whether they're by clever millionaires who studied whitepapers, or Uber drivers (as the anecdote goes) who jumped in after taking out a line of credit on the house, is investment in some of the companies behind the tech? For example, BTC companies like Blockstream funded things like satellites, while the Ethereum founder has been donating money to companies that help the Ethereum future.

Perhaps it's 'accidental investing with a dose of roulette number thrown in'.

Perhaps it's a new type of investment/gambling hybrid that requires a new category.

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