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Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

oceana.org

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Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#141

Post by bitcoinusername »

brailsafe wrote: post #137
bitcoinusername wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where exactly is it a luxury? In India? In Africa? I'm pretty sure ex-Yugoslavia area has a very good geography, if not better than most countries. You can grow soy there, just like in the USA, you can grow corn, wheat, you can raise chickens, you can do practically anything there, olives, oranges, grapes, forest fruit etc. What do vegetarians elsewhere eat? Is there a place on Earth where it's cheaper to grow protei…

There is a lot to it, but Geography is not a hierarchical system. In this case, it seems Yugoslavia, as with much of Europe, is great for agriculture. Despite the poverty, that is a luxury. Similar subsistence strategies have been used all over the world for thousands of years (only about 12000). There are places where farming is either not feasible, less energy efficient, or where exclusively plant-based diets aren'…

> There are places where farming is either not feasible, less energy efficient, or where exclusively plant-based diets aren't feasible.

I guess by this logic, since Sahara exists, eating food is a luxury.

Your definition of luxury has transformed into a supreme being just so you can call vegetarianism/veganism a luxury.

If you live in the first world, eating plants over eating meat is not a luxury. It's the cheapest form of healthy sustaining food there is.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#142

Post by hycaria »

kayhi wrote: post #59
swombat wrote: post #6

Do you feel helpless to stop the problem of antibiotics use in the meat industry? You’re not! Here’s a simple easy trick you can use to reduce its impact on the world: eat less meat. You don’t need meat in 3 meals a day. Reduce it to 1 meal a day and you’ve already reduced your antibiotics impact by 2/3. Cut down to one meat meal a week and that’s a 96% reduction. You’re not powerless. Vote with your wallet and your…

I sometimes wonder with problems like these that the underlying solution is controlling the global population.

How can you just wonder and not come to the obvious conclusion yet ? (By the way from my own observations, this opinion is strongly frowned upon here)

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#143

Post by weavie »

megaman22 wrote: post #111
greglindahl wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vegetarians eat calorie-heavy foods like fats, carbs, and protein, just like everyone else.

Arguably easier to eat a large number of calories on a vegetarian diet, than on its polar opposite, ketogenic diet. It's kind of hard work eating 3500 calories of just meat, eggs and cheese. Whereas that amount of bread, pasta, sweets, and other nominally vegetarian foodstuffs can be easily wolfed down.

Ketogenic diets are high fat. Having plenty of coconut oil, olive oil and butter with everything goes a long way to keeping up the calories and are quite easy to eat.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#144

Post by Broken_Hippo »

DrScump wrote: post #114
aaronbrethorst wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what a government is supposed to be doing: laws, regulations, and the ability to enforce them.

But there can be multiple governments involved.

So? The responsibility is on the government where the product is being sold. If they can't verify the origins, they can disallow that sell. I don't see the issue here other than it makes it complicated... which it would be anyway.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#145

Post by rublev »

swombat wrote: post #6

Do you feel helpless to stop the problem of antibiotics use in the meat industry? You’re not! Here’s a simple easy trick you can use to reduce its impact on the world: eat less meat. You don’t need meat in 3 meals a day. Reduce it to 1 meal a day and you’ve already reduced your antibiotics impact by 2/3. Cut down to one meat meal a week and that’s a 96% reduction. You’re not powerless. Vote with your wallet and your…

Yeah but I don't feel like suffering from every aspect of my life just to make an impact. My suffering will become a full time job. Focusing on not eating x/y/z, not wearing x/y/z, not doing x/y/z, not going to x, y, or z, for x/y/z reasons. And so on and so forth.

I work a day job, I don't have time to give a shit about most things, least of all adjusting my entire diet for activist ideology, let alone reading enough about these micro topics to get actionable data from. I have trouble just sticking to a solid routine every single day. If I possessed the power to just change my shit up for arbitrary disconnected reasons like lowering global antibiotics research, then I'd already have the mental fortitude to be a billionaire.

Would personally rather donate to a foundation that is able to accomplish the same goal on a larger scale. Our efforts should be focused on the rich putting their efforts into these things.

I never vote with my wallet. If I vote with my wallet and it costs me 2 hours to go across the city to get an item that's 14-16% of my day lost to acquire just one item in my life because I had the luxury of 'making a statement'.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#146

Post by golergka »

sifoo wrote: post #12

Fish farms are concentration camps for fish, same goes for the rest of the meat industry. The reason they need all the antibiotics is because the animals are so sick they just wouldn't survive without. Many still don't, it's just more effective to let 20% or so die if it allows stuffing more animals in the same space. Did anyone really think we would get away with treating animals like that and not have to face the c…

Your argument relies on the assumption that one would feel as much empathy towards animals as they do towards humans, or at least a comparable amount.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#147

Post by hueving »

jdietrich wrote: post #65
enord wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When has this attitude _ever_ been the solution to a shared-resource problem? I'm not being snarky, I want to know. It feels like solving traffic mortality by pasting a "drive carefully"-sticker inside the windshield, doing nothing other than establishing who is morally responsible.

Personal choices play a key role in advancing legislative change and facilitating effective enforcement. Legislation and enforcement only played a partial role in reducing the rate of driving while intoxicated. DWI was still normal and socially acceptable for decades after we started banning it. We changed our attitudes, we stigmatized the behaviour, we created new norms, we invented the concept of the "designated dr…

I strongly disagree with the attribution of drunk driving reductions to the culture. The culture is a byproduct of how significant the punishment has become, which is what really led to the reduction.

Back in the 70s getting pulled over drunk was punished like running a red light (i.e. a nominal fine). The punishments were ratcheted up to now where a DUI results in a 10k fine in some states and an immediate license suspension. With life altering punishments for getting caught, drunk driving reduced significantly and the culture of determining a DD emerged so people could continue to get hammered.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#148

Post by TeMPOraL »

_0w8t wrote: post #138
barrkel wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boycotting isn't individual choice, however; boycotts, when they work, usually work due to PR and reputational effects rather than market effects.

Boycotting works through the stubborn minority rule [1]. Sometimes even less than 1% of the total population can enforce their rule for the whole country. This works as long as the rest of population finds the rule does not bother them match. [1] http://fooledbyrandomness.com/minority.pdf

Wait, wait, wait.

I thought it was universally acknowledged that boycotts, generally, don't work, because you can almost never find and coordinate enough people that care.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#149

Post by c12 »

swombat wrote: post #6

Do you feel helpless to stop the problem of antibiotics use in the meat industry? You’re not! Here’s a simple easy trick you can use to reduce its impact on the world: eat less meat. You don’t need meat in 3 meals a day. Reduce it to 1 meal a day and you’ve already reduced your antibiotics impact by 2/3. Cut down to one meat meal a week and that’s a 96% reduction. You’re not powerless. Vote with your wallet and your…

Right now my wallet is doing the voting for me; can't afford meat in every meal, let alone one meal a day haha.

Re: Chile’s salmon farms may use more antibiotics than any other meat industry

#150

Post by xtrapolate »

enord wrote: post #14
swombat wrote: post #6

Do you feel helpless to stop the problem of antibiotics use in the meat industry? You’re not! Here’s a simple easy trick you can use to reduce its impact on the world: eat less meat. You don’t need meat in 3 meals a day. Reduce it to 1 meal a day and you’ve already reduced your antibiotics impact by 2/3. Cut down to one meat meal a week and that’s a 96% reduction. You’re not powerless. Vote with your wallet and your…

When has this attitude _ever_ been the solution to a shared-resource problem? I'm not being snarky, I want to know. It feels like solving traffic mortality by pasting a "drive carefully"-sticker inside the windshield, doing nothing other than establishing who is morally responsible.

  It feels like solving traffic mortality by pasting a "drive carefully"-sticker inside the windshield
Wouldn't a better analogy here be to "solve traffic mortality" by considerably reducing your exposure to dangerous situations (as in, driving less)?

There's a demand for meat, hence an industry working to supply (and profit-off-of) it. Encouraging people to eat less meat is making a difference.

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