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MacBook Pro? No

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Re: MacBook Pro? No

#181

Post by nimish »

AstralStorm wrote: post #151
Meekro wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 2015 Macbook Pro included an SSD, 2x Thunderbolt 2, 2x USB3, HDMI, and an SD card slot. It had 9 hours of battery life. Are you saying Intel chipsets actually regressed since then? If not, then it seems like Apple is the one who has regressed here.

Apple choose the low voltage CPU, weaker GPU and super slim case at the expense of ports and computational power. Also 9 instead of say 6 hour battery life. The only thing "Pro" in MacBook Pro is the price. At the same price points you can get Lenovo, Dell or HP workstation class laptops.

As a professional computer toucher, I definitely value battery life because a dead laptop doesn't let me get work done

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#182

Post by eecc »

Meekro wrote: post #97
eecc wrote: post #83

I’m also stuck on an old MacBook Pro model. Can’t justify the price but after some research — namely trying to find an equivalent Lenovo or Hp or whatever — I reached the conclusion that it’s mostly Intel’s fault. Let me explain: Intel chipsets don’t support enough lanes to supply USB-c, GPU, SSD and anything else with no less than 4 of them. The extra “legacy port breakout” ruins the tally and that’s why Apple dropp…

The 2015 Macbook Pro included an SSD, 2x Thunderbolt 2, 2x USB3, HDMI, and an SD card slot. It had 9 hours of battery life. Are you saying Intel chipsets actually regressed since then? If not, then it seems like Apple is the one who has regressed here.

No, not a regression just a gimped progression. Thunderbolt 2 carries 20Gb/s, while version 3 does 40Gb/s and requires 4 PCEe lanes. GPU wants another 4 and so does the SSD for a total of 12. My guess is that in older MBPs Tb would take 2 lanes leaving 2 for the legacy breakout hub, but Tb3 needs all of them to support multi-monitor 4K and imagine the howling if Apple gimped that instead.

I tend to blame Intel for cheaping out - or scrooging - on the PCI lanes... hopefully Ryzen and the Meltdown blunder will make Intel more generous.

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#183

Post by Miredly »

ak39 wrote: post #119
emptybits wrote: post #105

If Apple wants to cling to the now-inappropriate "Pro" brand for these MacBooks then may I suggest they add a new line: maybe, MacBook Ultimate or MacBook Power or MacBook Unlimited or MacBook Retrogrouch or something . Please make those units thicker for larger battery and replaceable RAM/SSD, with headphone and SD ports and MagSafe. Comments here suggest many of us would pay a premium for something like this.

Those product delineations exist currently. Macbook Air has always been touted as " high end specs, flexibility all with great portability". The Pro was sold as the mobile beast. There's some range confusion it seems.

There's so much range confusion over at Apple right now it's starting to feel like the 90's all over again.

Compare the Macbook with the 13" Macbook Pro, there's a ridiculous amount of overlap there that makes their pricing structure seem ridiculous.

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#184

Post by latch »

microtonal wrote: post #153
GordonS wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. The 2017 Macbook Pro is the first Macbook I've ever had, and I find the keyboard terrible . I can't put my finger on it exactly, but I just struggle to type on it, often finding letters missing from the words I've typed, and the keys never being where my fingers expect them to be. The key travel just feels wrong too. By comparison, I also have a very cheap Asus netbook (13", I think) - it was about £100…

It is interesting how polarizing the butterfly mechanism is. I absolutely love it. I can type more accurately and faster on it (they keys feel more stable) and I dread when I have to use an external keyboard with the old scissor switches or a pre-butteryfly MacBook. My colleagues who have a new MacBook Pro also prefer the new keyboard. The only large downside seems to be that it breaks more quickly. Of course, in the…

This is like saying the Xbox 360 is polarizing. It's not that some people love it and some people hate it. It's that some people get a working one and some people get a broken one.

There's enough complaints about broken butterfly keyboards to conclude that the failure rate is significantly higher (across both the first and second generation).

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#185

Post by aembleton »

buildbot wrote: post #56

Devils Advocate Response to this: If the keyboard is failing on a 2016, take advantage of Apple's stores and get it replaced under warranty and with far less hassle than say, Dell with an XPS 15 and failed motherboard. (From experience with both.) Battery life is typically quoted at 5 hours doing something relatively intensive, and 6-7 in general for the 15 inch. 4 hours must be heavy, high CPU and GPU use. I'm not s…

They could still include an external charging LED. For example, my Xiaomi Air 12 has an LED that changes between red, amber and green whilst it is charging to show the current state of the battery.

That laptop only has one USB-C so the placement of the indicator is simple, but Apple could include one somewhere.

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#186

Post by omnimus »

chrisper wrote: post #26
atmosx wrote: post #6

I have the exact opposite experience so far. By all means, this is a professional laptop in my opinion. To expand a bit: - I love the keyboard, best I've seen on a laptop (I'm a 80+ WPM typist) - I don't have issues with the touchbar, getting used to quickly manage apps like spotify. - My default editor is vim and don't have issues with escape - Trackpad is the best I've seen on a laptop - The machine is fast - The s…

>but the main reason to buy is the OS Is that still true? I feel like that argument is vanishing more and more these days.

It is for some. I love linux and want to use it but in printing industry you are done without adobe indesign. There is no good way to run indesign on linux.

I am hoping for kvm/virtulasition with gpu passthrough will soon be good enough solution.

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#187

Post by likeclockwork »

chipotle_coyote wrote: post #100
chrisper wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>but the main reason to buy is the OS Is that still true? I feel like that argument is vanishing more and more these days.

I suspect it's the part after this that's more important: > My workflow and tools are tailored around the mac. It's not that I can't find my way through Linux or even a BSD Laptop running i3. It's that I don't want to. I've been mostly full-time on the Mac since...2003, I think? I would be fine with Linux or FreeBSD, and I could live with Windows, but I'd just prefer not to. For me, macOS captures nearly everything t…

> drag and drop feels like a first-class UI metaphor

This is definitely a taste thing. Personally I hate drag and drop, everytime I'm forced to do it I wonder why the developers are making me perform virtual manual labor. Why am I applying constant pressure to carry things from one side of the screen to the other?

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#188

Post by bildung »

latch wrote: post #170
bildung wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again, your link is about consumer devices, not the thinkpad line.

"Again"? I'm missing a reference to something? Genuine question, why does the distinction matter?

I think the distinction matters because the Thinkpad line gets handled completely separately from the consumer devices, perhaps because it originally was a different company (IBM).

The "Again" wasn't meant to be snarky, sorry. Upthread you posted the same malware point and annother commenter already said that all the adware/malware stuff was consumer-only.

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#189

Post by solatic »

Why can't Apple make a MacBook Work machine? Design a keyboard with Cherry ML switches, large battery, no compromises on ports, 5 pound weight ceiling. Something that feels more blue-collar.

Re: MacBook Pro? No

#190

Post by jnwatson »

eecc wrote: post #83

I’m also stuck on an old MacBook Pro model. Can’t justify the price but after some research — namely trying to find an equivalent Lenovo or Hp or whatever — I reached the conclusion that it’s mostly Intel’s fault. Let me explain: Intel chipsets don’t support enough lanes to supply USB-c, GPU, SSD and anything else with no less than 4 of them. The extra “legacy port breakout” ruins the tally and that’s why Apple dropp…

The chipset doesn’t have to provide all the functionality. There’s no reason they couldn’t add another USB controller chip like most PC motherboards.

The RAM is technically Intel’s fault, even though it isn’t like Apple has no say in Intel’s roadmap.

IMHO the 2015 MacBook Pro was the apogee of Apple design. It will be hard to beat.

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