I feel sorry for the bloke whose legitimate password is
thisisjustadecoypasswordthatwillblowupthebombibroughtloljkNew DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
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Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#22Is this the United States of America or Nazi Germany circa 1930? Anyone with malicious or criminal intent can simply not carry data that implicates them over the border, so just what is the point of this?
Would you please not post ideological rants to HN, regardless of how correct the underlying position? Doing that is against the site guidelines, and we'd appreciate it if you'd read those and take the spirit of this site to heart: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html .
Thanks for the reminder. I edited my comment.
Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#23This is, of course, very upsetting for the obvious reasons. However, there's a second aspect to this that is (IMO) equally infuriating. Which is that even when the Supreme Court rules on something, which (credit where credit is due) has always done its best in making rulings as clear as possible for future similar cases, that politicians (of any party really) will still find a way around it.
In 1868 (Crandall v. Nevada) the Supreme court ruled that: "a state cannot inhibit people from leaving the state by taxing them."
Sure, maybe the word "tax" can be up for debate (although IMO taking someone's personal information is a tax). But if you look at point 8 at this link:
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/73/35/
It states that during the ruling, The Supreme Court ruled that: "8. The citizens of the United States have the correlative right to approach the great departments of the government, the ports of entry through which commerce is conducted, and the various federal offices in the states."
The "tax" inhibit this right.
It is now 2018 (150 years later) and we have simply replaced the word "tax" with a different obstacle, which functions in the same way: inhibiting the freedom of movement for those who don't (or can't) comply.
Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#24This should serve as a reminder to everyone to donate/support EFF and ACLU, as two of the very few organizations that watches for our rights. It is also a reminder that as we get more numb to issues like this, it gets worse. It is probably time to call your representatives and raise your voice.
Because calling paid-for representatives has such a strong record of success over the last decade of human rights erosion. Talking to your representative is roughly as useful in curbing these things, as doing nothing at all. What's the real solution?
The real solution is changing lobbying, but i am not educated enough about us politics to tell how.
Also supporting EFF & ACLU and their efforts to use the laws seems to be somewhat effective.
It also comes back to the individual convenience vs collective action. If everybody obeys the orders of border agents, police, etc without exercising their rights because they have nothing to hide, this gets easier by the day.
This is not about hiding something, this is about harrasment of an individual's privacy.
Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#25I don't know if it worries my American chums, but I won't visit the USA. As a foreign tourist bringing money into your economy I feel there is a very real risk to my privacy and increasingly my person. I am beginning to favour goods and services from EU where human rights still mean something. Perhaps it doesn't matter to you how the US is perceived overseas, perhaps you don't want my money. Perhaps you don't mind be…
I sometimes have to go to the US for business purposes but from now on will only do so with a wiped computer with just enough installed to look like a normal user's data.
Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Talking to your representative is roughly as useful in curbing these things, as doing nothing at all Have you ever called your representatives?
www.google.com/search?q=i+contacted+my+representative+site%3Areddit.com Knock yourself out. Spoiler alert: almost everyone reports getting a cookie-cutter email or scripted response about why the rep will stay the course. They clearly have an established strategy of how to handle the 'contact your rep' crowd and channel their efforts to /dev/null.
> almost everyone reports getting a cookie-cutter email or scripted response about why the rep will stay the course
Who is “almost everyone”? Any personal experience?
Mine involves getting a personal e-mail from my state Assemblyman, being patched in to the senior legislative aide to my U.S. Congresswoman who spoke to me at length about the issue, getting follow-up by e-mail to calls after the points I raised were discussed with my U.S. Senator, and being reached out to by my state Senator’s office for input on a draft bill. I also know that for my tech-savvy Manhattan Congressional district I am usually one of a small handful voters regularly calling in about digital privacy.
I’m fine with voters being busy or lazy. But don’t brag about it.
Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#27use truecrypt
Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#28I don't know if it worries my American chums, but I won't visit the USA. As a foreign tourist bringing money into your economy I feel there is a very real risk to my privacy and increasingly my person. I am beginning to favour goods and services from EU where human rights still mean something. Perhaps it doesn't matter to you how the US is perceived overseas, perhaps you don't want my money. Perhaps you don't mind be…
I sometimes have to go to the US for business purposes but from now on will only do so with a wiped computer with just enough installed to look like a normal user's data.
wait, so you're actually a spy? What kind of user are you if not a normal one?
Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#29Re: New DHS policy on demands for passwords to travelers’ electronic devices
#30> “What is the password to this device?” is a verbal collection of information, which is prohibited by the Paperwork Reduction Act (PRA) unless it has been approved in advance by the Office of Management and Budget (OMB), a “control number” has been assigned by OMB, and individuals from whom information is to be collected are given notice of this.
I find this extremely implausible. If it were true, wouldn't it also imply that customs and immigration officers aren't allowed to ask any questions that don't appear on the customs form? I thought it was generally accepted that they had a wide latitude to conduct an interview and use the results to determine admissibility.
The Paperwork Reduction Act is primarily designed to regulate exactly what it sounds like -- standardized forms for data collection. It specifically excludes "A request for facts or opinions addressed to a single person". (https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?c=ecfr&rgn=div5&view=t...)