The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages • Hacker News Board

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#41

Post by swivelmaster » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:23 AM UTC

djroomba wrote: post #14

I've seen a few indie developers actively antagonize so called gamers. I've seen abusive companies like EA get rightfully called out. So Im skeptical of the depth of the claims, but I believe there are a few crazies. I've ran a few foreign tax information websites, and I got extraordinary death threats very graphic and very detailed. I think the internet really allows the mentally ill to scream for the attention they…

Do you think the type of abuse that EA received was appropriate?

The answer is: Absolutely not. Remember when Mass Effect: Andromeda came out and the facial animation system was broken? Some enterprising players looked through the game credits, found a woman they thought was responsible for said animations, and personally harassed her about it.

If you think this abuse is limited to complaining about loot boxes, you're wrong; it isn't.

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#42

Post by tehwebguy » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:27 AM UTC

arkades wrote: post #25

Pfhreak wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Games have credits. Developers have Twitter accounts. Devs are excited about their work, share what they are working on. The devs are not seeking these interactions at all.

All of my patients know my name. It’s on a badge, with a picture ID and all. This includes drug seekers, people looking for a suit, a handout, and just a general smattering of crazy folks. Yet they don’t manage to find my fb, my Twitter, my LinkedIn. Part of this is that devs plug deeply into social media, personally and professionally, and have few (or no) firewalls between the two. Unless you -have- to be the publi…

Do you need to constantly network so you can get a new job as a doctor if your next big release fails and your employer / project folds?

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#43

Post by mattmanser » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:27 AM UTC

arkades wrote: post #32

vvanders wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're assuming that game developers want to live in some sort of isolated ivory tower. Everyone I knew who got into the industry did it to share the joy that gaming brought them to other people. It's an explicitly social industry in that respect. Also, I don't know of a single place that can afford to run interference for every single dev. Even on the large AAA stuff I worked on we were lucky to have 1 or 2 marketin…

I’m assuming no such thing. I’m saying this is a “have your cake and eat it too” issue. Either you’re accessible to millions or you arent, and that choice comes with benefits and drawbacks. If one can’t handle the drawbacks of being publicly accessible to millions, one should go to great pains to prevent that, rather than lamenting the inevitable - and I do mean inevitable - long tail of jerks. And when I say “run in…

It's ok to be an asshole because it's over the internet? These people wouldn't say what they're saying to others in real life.

It's a serious problem with online interactions, especially in the gaming field where people get unreasonably passionate and there's a lot of sexually frustrated young men needing to vent their anger.

Hell, I've been an asshole here on HN, I know I have been, it's so much easier to be without seeing someone's face.

It doesn't make it ok or acceptable though, and unfortunately I feel I have to downvote and speak against you because what you're doing is defending hate and evil. It shouldn't have to be a cost of business, it's not business, it's an unfortunate side effect of the free and open and anonymous internet. It doesn't mean we should accept it though.

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#44

Post by cageface » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:28 AM UTC

I'm sure this is worse for game devs but I think it affects anybody that creates customer-facing apps. The culture of rudeness and entitlement among customers today is very deep rooted. It's one of several reasons why it's smarter to build B2B businesses.

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#45

Post by QAPereo » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:29 AM UTC

swivelmaster wrote: post #39

I had a long phone conversation recently with a game industry friend who had the misfortune of being involved in multiple games that became targets of abuse. I had asked him for advice about potentially making some youtube videos about game design, including f2p game design (which I have substantial expertise in). He warned me that depending on the approach, even implying that I thought certain types of games or mone…

Death threats and abuse are a non-starter, but working on making more addictive games-cum-casinos should probably come with polite disdain. Given that so much in gaming has become a money grab from kids and people wired to gamble is, a shame.

So... death threats? Doxxing? Abuse? No, never.

Respect for a good job well done? Also no.

Hunting “whales” for vast profits is a good business model, but so is selling tobacco or opening a casino. I don’t know that pandering to addictive personalities, the young, the inexperienced, and the impulsive is a very good use of anyone’s talents. Worse, it’s going to turn s generation off the medium once they realize how abusive it’s becoming.

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#46

Post by jnordwick » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:30 AM UTC

Yawn. A lot of professions deal with this. I work in high frequency trading, and i get told I'm the Devil by people multiple times a week including major publications. But i love what i do and nobodys unintelligent abuse is going to change that.

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#47

Post by swivelmaster » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:31 AM UTC

QAPereo wrote: post #45

swivelmaster wrote: post #39

I had a long phone conversation recently with a game industry friend who had the misfortune of being involved in multiple games that became targets of abuse. I had asked him for advice about potentially making some youtube videos about game design, including f2p game design (which I have substantial expertise in). He warned me that depending on the approach, even implying that I thought certain types of games or mone…

Death threats and abuse are a non-starter, but working on making more addictive games-cum-casinos should probably come with polite disdain. Given that so much in gaming has become a money grab from kids and people wired to gamble is, a shame. So... death threats? Doxxing? Abuse? No, never. Respect for a good job well done? Also no. Hunting “whales” for vast profits is a good business model, but so is selling tobacco…

Not all of the games involved were mtx-based. One was more like "you screwed up the IP I love, die!"

edit: Also, it is profoundly unhelpful to the discussion to say what you said, which is basically "Well, what did you expect, a pat on the back?"

We're talking here about abuse, not constructive criticism. Here's an analogy: Nobody expects an Oscar for working on Transformers 6, but personally subjecting them to online abuse for it is totally unacceptable. There's no need to come into the discussion and remind us that Transformers 6 is not likely to be a very good movie.

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#48

Post by tehwebguy » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:31 AM UTC

jancsika wrote: post #4

Do all game devs experience similar types of abuse, or only the devs of games with environments in which the developer's company is attempting to monetize the player as they move through the game? For example-- there is some beautiful sidescroller game I've seen where the animation looks like old-school Fleischer studio cartoons. Do devs of games like that get abuse from players, too?

Check out Fez

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#49

Post by arkades » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:32 AM UTC

yannyu wrote: post #38

arkades wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m assuming no such thing. I’m saying this is a “have your cake and eat it too” issue. Either you’re accessible to millions or you arent, and that choice comes with benefits and drawbacks. If one can’t handle the drawbacks of being publicly accessible to millions, one should go to great pains to prevent that, rather than lamenting the inevitable - and I do mean inevitable - long tail of jerks. And when I say “run in…

While what you're saying may be true, maybe we should be questioning why this kind of communication is considered acceptable and without consequence in the gaming community.

Whether it’s acceptable isn’t the point. If 70% of people do it, it’s acceptable. If .1% of people do it, it’s not - but if you’re taking .1% of a very large number, the result is untenable for those on the receiving end.

This is a problem -without- requiring it to be acceptable behavior.

Re: The problem of game developers receiving abusive messages

#50

Post by arkades » Fri, Jan 12, 2018, 12:34 AM UTC

tehwebguy wrote: post #42

arkades wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of my patients know my name. It’s on a badge, with a picture ID and all. This includes drug seekers, people looking for a suit, a handout, and just a general smattering of crazy folks. Yet they don’t manage to find my fb, my Twitter, my LinkedIn. Part of this is that devs plug deeply into social media, personally and professionally, and have few (or no) firewalls between the two. Unless you -have- to be the publi…

Do you need to constantly network so you can get a new job as a doctor if your next big release fails and your employer / project folds?

I mean, kind of?

Not to and with patients, but certainly to and with other docs and healthcare executives. The age of “I open a private practice and work there until I die” came to an end about a decade ago. Never mind requiring a constant stream of referrals. I have to network pretty constantly.