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CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

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Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#141
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, login in Fortnite is over 443 and it uses normal HTTPS. It also uses HTTPs to load a lot of other data such as server data, friends list, chat etc. Unreal Engine comes with a version of chromium built in which is used for many in game things like social tabs, news, and in game purchases these all work over HTTP/S. Game data is sent over 5222 TCP.

Out of interest, do you know if the game data uses XMPP or if it just uses the same port?

It does not. It's all based on the UE4 network stack.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#142

Huge real world performance impact, they didn't say how much but it looks like close to 100%. I smell a class action lawsuit coming.

More than a doubling of CPU use, but for consistency's sake:

The other percentages we've been offered have been in terms of performance reduction. We were told to expect a range of 5-30%; this is about 60%.

Somewhere a sysadmin's hair has started smoldering.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#143
post #137

Huge real world performance impact, they didn't say how much but it looks like close to 100%. I smell a class action lawsuit coming.

Why? This wasn't gross incompetence in processor design, this kind of attack is completely new. I don't see how a class action could apply here, by IANAL

Doesn't stop people from filing one. They already have, in fact. I agree that it shouldn't get anywhere, but I'm not as sanguine about whether or not it actually will.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#144
post #137

Huge real world performance impact, they didn't say how much but it looks like close to 100%. I smell a class action lawsuit coming.

Why? This wasn't gross incompetence in processor design, this kind of attack is completely new. I don't see how a class action could apply here, by IANAL

It doesn't have to be gross incompetence. If you pay for something and it doesn't deliver as promised, you may be entitled to a partial or full refund.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#145
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That wasn't snarky because it was only mildly critical. Since it was mild, it also wasn't cutting. Lastly, it was not derogatory or mocking in an indirect way and so it was not snide either.

I disagree. Aside from the sarcastic "buffer overflow" comment, his comment was far more snide than any of the replies he seemed to be complaining about. Since you take a different view though, as I asked in my post, if it's not "snarky" then what was it?

[deleted]

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#146
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That wasn't snarky because it was only mildly critical. Since it was mild, it also wasn't cutting. Lastly, it was not derogatory or mocking in an indirect way and so it was not snide either.

Replying here, since the other post I replied to disappeared: Despite the avalanche of downvotes burying my posts, not even one person can actually answer the question I asked: The poster could have simply stopped typing after "Thank you for the explanation". He chose to unnecessarily add something more. So, for everyone who disagrees with me: if what he said wasn't itself "snarky", what was it?

> if what he said wasn't itself "snarky", what was it?

A complaint that Hacker News is a less agreeable place than it used to be. Whether that's true or not, don't you think you might find a more effective way of counter-arguing than by being as disagreeable as you can possibly manage without outright swearing in your responses?

I get that you're sure that you're right. That's great! That's a source of strong motivation to pursue an argument. But it suffices really nothing just to say "I'm right", and much less just to say "you're wrong". If you're interested in convincing people that the argument you're advancing is a more accurate model of reality than those with which it's contending, then you have to do just that - convince people, by answering their points with compelling counterarguments of your own.

And if you want to shape the discussion such that it's possible for you to convince anyone of anything, then you must above all treat your interlocutors with impeccable respect, no matter how wrong you may think - or know! - they are. To do otherwise only hardens them against whatever you may have to say, and the outcome you thus produce is even less favorable than that of simply declining to engage in the first place. Conversely, treating those around you with respect tends very strongly to elicit respect toward you from them, in turn. That's how you earn the fair hearing you need to make arguments that might convince, and thus give yourself a place to start.

Perhaps that sounds like a normative, rather than a positive, statement. I've seen people react badly in the past, and sling accusations of "tone policing" and all manner of other offenses against some apparently very abstract conception of discursive mores which may hold sway in occasional quarters but is very far from predominating. I'm not telling you how you should behave in the sort of discourse where "tone policing" is a meaningful phrase - indeed I'm not telling you how you should behave at all. What I'm telling you is that, whatever places you may have been where you found unstinting contempt for your interlocutors to serve your turn, none of those places is here.

That's why hectoring people, as I have observed you fairly consistently to do here, doesn't convince people of your points. At most it convinces them to stop trying to talk with you. Perhaps that's the result you're trying to produce, in which case keep doing what you're doing! But if you're not trying to develop for yourself a reputation here of being someone best avoided, then you may wish to revise your style of argumentation somewhat.

Now before you get too cross with me saying this as I have, consider: We spoke briefly the other day on the subject of complaining about downvotes and why it is not helpful. You seem genuinely upset to accrue them so easily, and I treated that dismay perhaps more cavalierly than was justified. I'm sorry for that; to try to make up for it, I thought I'd explain why it is they keep happening and what you can do to change that.

You clearly expect respectful engagement from others, and there's nothing wrong with that. But when you refuse to engage respectfully with others, who quite reasonably expect the same, it isn't really a surprise when people choose to answer that disrespect by downvoting and moving on, rather than by eliciting your further contempt through an attempt to engage with you.

The good news is that you have in your hands the power to change this state of affairs! The style of your discourse is entirely within your control. Show respect to those around you, and you'll find those around you show you respect in return. You can totally do that! You can totally make that happen. I hope you'll choose to do so.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you be able to post some ballpark figures, please?

Actually, there is not any measurable difference. Our architecture is completely state-less and when compared with equivalent load there's no difference at all. I guess, default network throughput bottle-neck itself is higher than the random memory cache bottle-neck in my case. There was no impact on the latency either. Fearing automatic update by AWS resulting in performance issue, we rushed to update all our serves…

Thanks - this is what's worrying me: the result of patching seems to be all over the map, and it's somewhat hard to predict. My biggest worry is SQL Server, so our plan is to fix a performance issue we isolated recently before we patch - I'd like that system running optimally before we take the hit.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#148

Huge real world performance impact, they didn't say how much but it looks like close to 100%. I smell a class action lawsuit coming.

More than a doubling of CPU use, but for consistency's sake: The other percentages we've been offered have been in terms of performance reduction. We were told to expect a range of 5-30%; this is about 60%. Somewhere a sysadmin's hair has started smoldering.

I’d go farther, anybody who is concerned with application performance may soon see/smell their hair smoldering.

We write a lot of code that needs to run as fast as possible (processing, post-processing, generating real-time weather/satellite data) and I’m concerned about time windows and whether we’ll be able to meet requirements.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More than a doubling of CPU use, but for consistency's sake: The other percentages we've been offered have been in terms of performance reduction. We were told to expect a range of 5-30%; this is about 60%. Somewhere a sysadmin's hair has started smoldering.

I’d go farther, anybody who is concerned with application performance may soon see/smell their hair smoldering. We write a lot of code that needs to run as fast as possible (processing, post-processing, generating real-time weather/satellite data) and I’m concerned about time windows and whether we’ll be able to meet requirements.

Meltdown is aptly named, as that is what's gonna happen to the global corporate services market, "efficiently" hosted in the cloud and scraping for profitability.

Re: CPU Usage Differences After Applying Meltdown Patch at Epic Games

#150
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I recall correctly from older posts (I played Fortnite for a while), they're using AWS.

That's still not answering many questions. I hope they publish a full analysis at some point.

Since they're using default provisioned EC2 instances, it's likely that the developers don't necessarily even fully understand their performance degradation. They just expect the service that they pay for to work properly.
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