Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake • Hacker News Board

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#261

Post by wellboy » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 7:57 PM UTC

downandout wrote: post #223

lettergram wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"worth" being valuation based on debt. We don't know their worth because they aren't public.

It’s worth what people are willing to pay for it. In this latest transaction, people are willing to invest billions at a $48 billion valuation. This money isn’t even flowing to the company, but rather to individual shareholders. That means it is currently worth $48 billion.

That worth is the worth paid by people who don't know all the information, sold by people who didn't give all the information.

Uber also wasn't worth $70B in the last round, investors didn't know that sexism was rampant and the culture horrible, which would have surely made them not invest if they had talked to female employees at uber.

However, they didn't know that the culture is horrible and not able to grow another 10x under these conditions and conquer the autonomous driving market.

They also didn't know that Uber had all these patent problem, but they did.

Now, investors have invested at a $48B valuation, but they still overpaid, because they don't know all the information. Maybe they didn't care, because Uber told them, they will definitely be able to bloat up the company to $100, so that SoftBank makes their 2x. Surely they also have liquidation preference.

So, they actual valuation of Uber, including all the bad that no one knows, is probably only at $10B.

It could also only be $1B, since Uber probably won't compete in the autonomous car market and can only make $50M profit per year after stripping away all its overhead. But most people don't know this.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#262

Post by AlexandrB » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 8:32 PM UTC

TallGuyShort wrote: post #207

AlexandrB wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Over the last 50 years American exceptionalism has morphed from: "We are the greatest country on earth, unique in our ability to achieve." to "We are the most special snowflake country in the world, unique in our inability to improve healthcare, public infrastructure, or reduce deaths by firearms." It's really quite sad, I hope you guys get our of your rut soon.

Considering actual firearm violence has actually shrunk a lot in recent decades, I feel you have just a hint of bias based on a political agenda there.

It's shrunk a lot relative to the US peak [1]. Relative to other western powers it's still in a league of its own [2]. I think your comment is more indicative of a political agenda than mine.

And for the record, if the United States as a society decides that gun ownership is important enough to let the mass shootings continue that's OK with me. What bugs me more is the perennial argument that gun control wouldn't solve anything or that it's impossible for the US to address its gun violence problem even if it wanted to.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_Sta...

[2] https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/14/upshot/compare-these-gun-...

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#263

Post by AlexandrB » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 8:39 PM UTC

unethical_ban wrote: post #234

AlexandrB wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Over the last 50 years American exceptionalism has morphed from: "We are the greatest country on earth, unique in our ability to achieve." to "We are the most special snowflake country in the world, unique in our inability to improve healthcare, public infrastructure, or reduce deaths by firearms." It's really quite sad, I hope you guys get our of your rut soon.

As someone who has grown up in the South, and who has visited San Francisco, Philadelphia, DC, NYC, Boston and other places, I agree public transport is amazing, and I wish cities in the South could pull it off. I also recognize it's incredibly difficult, and expensive, to do so. And even if we had the money and ability to build rail along freeway lines, and build stops at popular social and residential hubs, how do…

> You're really blowing off something incredibly difficult, more difficult (politically and financially) than putting someone on the moon.

You're probably right, but I also think that the main roadblocks are political, not financial. The US has one of the highest GDP/capita in the world but consistently fails to apply this economic power to helping its own citizens or does so in extremely wasteful ways like creating jobs through military spending.

Edit: Also public infrastructure isn't just transport. There are cities in the US that do not have safe drinking water. It's shocking.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#264

Post by ricksanch88 » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 8:44 PM UTC

amazingman wrote: post #130

kinkrtyavimoodh wrote: post #34

Happy for him. I can only imagine how much being ousted from a company he created and raised to its current level must have hurt. I do not look fondly at what a pain local transport was in cities without public transport (and even those with), and it is Travis (yes, Travis first, Uber second) that led this paradigm shift. We can debate about Uber's business practices until the cows come home, but this is undeniable.…

I love how you completely gloss over Kalanick’s pivotal role in building one of the worst company cultures in SV, and how the tech culture at large suffered for it both in terms of PR and furthering the spread of douchebag ideology.

To be fair SV does a pretty good job at spreading douchebag ideology, with or without Kalanick.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#265

Post by msmith10101 » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 9:37 PM UTC

Looks like both Benchmark and Travis Kalanick wanted to sell more stock than they were able to. Can someone explain who was able to sell stock and how their sell preferences were prioritized and executed? Was everyone able to sell at least one percent of their holdings, for example?

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#266

Post by natecavanaugh » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 10:59 PM UTC

bkor wrote: post #151

natecavanaugh wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say that public transportation doesn't always work, here or elsewhere. Subways and buses usually have schedules that don't always line up with when you happen to need it. Also, there is a mental tax in having to navigate it. For instance, I really have a hard time reading subway/train maps and schedules, and God forbid I need to connect to a different line during the route. Sure, plenty of people are totally…

> Subways and buses usually have schedules that don't always line up with when you happen to need it. Also, there is a mental tax in having to navigate it. There's no need for any difference between navigating by car in Google Maps or navigating by public transport in Google Maps. Meaning, in Netherlands Google Maps show the estimated arrival times of everything, transfers, etc. It'll take into account delays, cancel…

I would say there is one difference, which is that you may or may not have data access. I've been traveling internationally for over 10 years now, and never had cellular data when I would travel (thanks ATT), and most airports would have wifi, but different subways/trains etc don't. And I've been in a situation of relying only on GPS and hoping the app doesn't shut down while I'm walking somewhere far too many times.

Google has improved here with their offline maps, but even then, it's not 100%.

I'm not saying that PT is worthless or that we shouldn't improve it, but IMHO, Uber and the like fill a very critical "last mile" kind of problem that I think pairs nicely in cities with public transportation.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#267

Post by sirspacey » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 11:26 PM UTC

forgotpw2018 wrote: post #137

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you ever consider what a tremendous waste of time this competition with other frats was? Trying to determine how many people were at their parties? Are we supposed to take this seriously?

Compared to what the average college student was doing? No. It was a great use of time. We had a team, a goal, and a purpose. No stupider than being on mock trial or chess team. It's all pointless if you think about it too much, but that competition drove a ton of benefits to the school. IFC (Interfraternity counsil) ran most of the school events. Our attendance at official school functions like football games or pre…

I’d be very interested to learn more from your experience. i see great potential in Greek orgs, a training ground that is systematically undervalued. if you’d be game for an interview, my email is: sirspacey.hn at the Gmail

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#268

Post by forapurpose » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 11:52 PM UTC

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #160

forapurpose wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jobs is a great point, for the other argument. Jobs didn't break the law, but he disrupted multiple industries from computers to phones to music to retail.

> Jobs didn't break the law Jobs often took an “ask for forgivenss” approach. Copying Xerox [1], screwing Wozniak [2], the naming schtick with the Beatles, et cetera . [1] http://www.mac-history.net/computer-history/2012-03-22/apple... [2] http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/steve-wozniak-cried-jobs-kept-atari...

>> Jobs didn't break the law

> Jobs often took an “ask for forgivenss” approach.

So we agree: He didn't break the law. Being a jerk to his co-founder is not at all comparable.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#269

Post by forapurpose » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 11:54 PM UTC

fernandotakai wrote: post #153

forapurpose wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many businesses have 'disrupted' industries, and almost all without behaving like Uber and Kalanick. Airbnb is a simple example. Your description left out buying off politicians and breaking the law. > taxi cartels The picture of taxi owners as powerful doesn't at all match what I know. It's a shibboleth promoted by Uber.

> The picture of taxi owners as powerful doesn't at all match what I know. It's a shibboleth promoted by Uber. the city where i live (a 12 million people city) taxi cartels are so powerful, the leader of one of those has dinner with the governor. he has meetings with senators. there is recording of him calling for taxi drivers within his "association" to violently attack uber drivers and nothing was done. also, taxi…

> the city where i live (a 12 million people city) taxi cartels are so powerful, the leader of one of those has dinner with the governor. he has meetings with senators

Do you think Uber's leaders might do the same?

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#270

Post by forapurpose » Fri, Jan 05, 2018, 11:59 PM UTC

Aunche wrote: post #249

geofft wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are taxicab medallions worth it? I'm in favor of the rule of law. If I was in favor of the rule of law when it did good things and not when it did bad things (and I ready admit that the medallion system is one of the bad things), and wanted outside companies with private capital to ignore the rule of law to fix the bad things... I wouldn't be in favor of the rule of law at all. The ultimate question is who we choos…

It doesn't have to be black and white. The purpose of democracy is to reflect the will of the people, but it's not efficient. If more people agree with Uber than some antiquated laws, I have no problem with supporting Uber. Tesla also broke laws by selling their cars without going through a dealership, but I don't think anyone has a problem with that.

> If more people agree with Uber than some antiquated laws, I have no problem with supporting Uber.

How do you know if "more people agree"? Has there been a public debate and a vote?

If there was a vote, it would be direct democracy, which has some serious drawbacks. One is that most people have very little time to become informed on these issues; that's why they elect representatives to deal with them.

Finally, straight majority rule is just mob rule. Someone said, 'democracy must be more than two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner'. What if the majority wanted to take your house away? Take your business away? Stop someone from speaking? Stop the minority party from accepting donations? That's why we have the rule of law, not the rule of the majority.