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Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

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Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#111

Post by cocktailpeanuts »

adjkant wrote: post #106
cocktailpeanuts wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It wasn't allegations of sexual harassment The "sexual harassment" claim was for an employee (or employees), it wasn't him who sexually harassed someone. There is sexual harassment everywhere. Probably at your company too, it's just that people wanted to see Uber fail, and that's why he's become the sacred cow. I'm not saying he did a great job dealing with these issues. I'm saying a lot of the things Uber was accu…

> it's just that people wanted to see Uber fail, and that's why he's become the sacred cow. The sexual harassment did not come out because people wanted to see Uber fail. People want Uber to fail because it came out, and the extent of it. Extent is a very important factor. This was not "a person was sexually harassed once at a company", which does indeed happen at many places. This was a larger pattern and intrinsic…

If you think Uber is uniquely evil, you are too naive my friend.

Again, i'm not trying to say Uber was ethical, so don't try to tell me I'm some Uber fanboy.

I'm just pointing out among all evil corporations Uber was the one to fall and there are plenty of disgusting reasons behind it which most people who criticize Uber have no idea of. And I'm talking about this point. The world thinks they've won because they've punished Uber, but what they've done is just play into hidden politics that made some shady people behind the scenes more money.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#112

Post by jeffdavis »

craigching wrote: post #94
kinkrtyavimoodh wrote: post #34

Happy for him. I can only imagine how much being ousted from a company he created and raised to its current level must have hurt. I do not look fondly at what a pain local transport was in cities without public transport (and even those with), and it is Travis (yes, Travis first, Uber second) that led this paradigm shift. We can debate about Uber's business practices until the cows come home, but this is undeniable.…

> I do not look fondly at what a pain local transport was in cities without public transport (and even those with), and it is Travis (yes, Travis first, Uber second) that led this paradigm shift. How about we improve public transport? I know it’s unpopular to propose “socialist” ideas, but public transport works elsewhere in the world, why does it have to be so horrible here? Why does someone have to profit for somet…

There are a lot of practical challenges here because this country was already built for cars as the universal form of transport.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#114

Post by adjkant »

cocktailpeanuts wrote: post #111
adjkant wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's just that people wanted to see Uber fail, and that's why he's become the sacred cow. The sexual harassment did not come out because people wanted to see Uber fail. People want Uber to fail because it came out, and the extent of it. Extent is a very important factor. This was not "a person was sexually harassed once at a company", which does indeed happen at many places. This was a larger pattern and intrinsic…

If you think Uber is uniquely evil, you are too naive my friend. Again, i'm not trying to say Uber was ethical, so don't try to tell me I'm some Uber fanboy. I'm just pointing out among all evil corporations Uber was the one to fall and there are plenty of disgusting reasons behind it which most people who criticize Uber have no idea of. And I'm talking about this point. The world thinks they've won because they've p…

Actually, the world is all run by 3 dogs making decisions in Japan. Trust me, Uber is just their pawn. Nothing else matters, every other ethical fault is meaningless.

You're going to have to actually provide some examples and/or evidence before I believe most companies do all of this regularly. I'd argue most terrible ethical actions of companies are out in the open and more socially accepted.

> "The world thinks they've won because they've punished Uber, but what they've done is just play into hidden politics that made some shady people behind the scenes more money."

This is one small thing, but I'll take it over nothing.

I'm not blind to the larger power struggle of the world all mostly hidden from view. But, if this didn't happen, a different group of shady people wins on the other side of the hidden politics. Last I checked there aren't big differences in the shady hidden political system's parties.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#115

Post by raiyu »

rifung wrote: post #89
cocktailpeanuts wrote: post #32

Good for him. This is probably an unpopular opinion here, but I feel bad for this guy. Could have built a really great empire, and he probably would have if it was ten years ago. But things are changing so fast nowadays and the masses have a lot of power (maybe too much than they deserve) and Uber unfortunately was at the wrong place at the wrong time. When I talk to real people in the real world (not Twitter trolls…

> He deserves every cent of his billions of dollars. He deserves the money he made by making a company that was competitive by knowingly skirting laws? That seems like a bad precedent to set.

Yes and no. Was it operating in a gray area, yes.

However, that gray area wasn't the equivalent of dumping toxic waste into a river to build some product. The gray area was around how taxis were regulated in markets.

As a frequent Uber/Lyft/Taxi user in NYC I can say that the experience for the consumer has been fantastic. I never want to use a taxi again for many reasons.

1. There's very little recourse for lost items 2. You can't get one on-demand (now you can with apps but not before) 3. There's no recourse for having a bad driver or ensuring a good pleasant ride

So while it operated in the gray it was around archaic laws, it wasn't like it was destroying the environment.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#116

Post by raiyu »

paunchy wrote: post #8

Although unsurprising, this can't be a good indicator for the outlook of the company.

The value has already been cut in half from the peak raise, however him selling shares isn't a bad outlook for company.

He's no longer CEO, part of the deal is he won't be chairman, he will be for all intents and purposes not involved with the business and at arms length so why not cash out $1B dollars and go live your life instead of stewing waiting for something to happen.

Is there more value to be created? Perhaps and very likely. But I think Travis just wants to close this chapter as quickly as possible and move on.

Certainly to have $1-2B in the bank changes your life completely and he will go figure out what all of this means for him now.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#117

Post by forapurpose »

raiyu wrote: post #115
rifung wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He deserves every cent of his billions of dollars. He deserves the money he made by making a company that was competitive by knowingly skirting laws? That seems like a bad precedent to set.

Yes and no. Was it operating in a gray area, yes. However, that gray area wasn't the equivalent of dumping toxic waste into a river to build some product. The gray area was around how taxis were regulated in markets. As a frequent Uber/Lyft/Taxi user in NYC I can say that the experience for the consumer has been fantastic. I never want to use a taxi again for many reasons. 1. There's very little recourse for lost ite…

> gray area

It's not gray; it was black and white. Companies need to follow the law.

> archaic laws

The laws Uber is accused of violating, including their attempts to deceive law enforcement, are not archaic.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#118

Post by forapurpose »

cocktailpeanuts wrote: post #27
tw1010 wrote: post #25

What an incredible twist. I bet most people would have pinned him as the next Jobs or Gates only a few years ago.

> I bet most people would have pinned him as the next Jobs And they would have been absolutely correct. Exactly what happened to Steve Jobs.

> Exactly what happened to Steve Jobs.

Jobs wasn't fired for serially violating the law, risking his company's survival, damaging its reputation (EDIT: and mistreating everyone from female employees to rape victims).

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#119

Post by forapurpose »

logicchains wrote: post #100
forapurpose wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no evidence that the unethical behavior was necessary or even helped. > powerfully entrenched politicians (DeBlasio of NYC as an example) DeBlasio is entrenched because he was elected by a majority of his constituents. The people get to write the rules, called laws. Who voted for Kalanick? What gave him the right?

>Who voted for Kalanick? What gave him the right? You could say people voted with their wallets.

> You could say people voted with their wallets.

You could say it, but that's not how democracy or legitimate government and lawmaking works. And in Uber's case, the wallets voting are a few investors who subsidized the customers.

Re: Uber Co-Founder Travis Kalanick Said to Plan Sale of 29% of Stake

#120

Post by forapurpose »

remarkEon wrote: post #96
forapurpose wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jobs is a great point, for the other argument. Jobs didn't break the law, but he disrupted multiple industries from computers to phones to music to retail.

You’re absolutely right. And Travis needs to be criticized for that (and he is). If the question, though, is about judging a company’s contribution to society based on how morally upstanding the founder is I think the point I’m trying to make still stands.

> If the question, though, is about judging a company’s contribution to society based on how morally upstanding the founder is ...

Far more than Kalanick's behavior, it is the company's practices that are the problem. They willfully broke the law and they also mistreated many people from employees to drivers to rape victims.

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