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Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

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Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#71
>This is not how companies normally do their thing. I’ve been listening to Adam Smith’s 1776 classic on the Wealth of Nations, and just passed through the chapter on how the market is set by masters trying to get away with paying the least possible, and workers trying to press for the maximum possible. An antagonistic struggle, surely.

Sounds exactly like Jeff Bezos, who owns part of Basecamp.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#72
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People often tell me, "Yeah the Bay Area is expensive but the tech salaries make up for it." By being able to get a Bay Area salary (e.g. $150k/year) while working from anywhere in the world (e.g. any city where $40k/year is considered comfortable living and $80k/year is considered "well off"), the incentive to continue saturating the area with local talent decreases. Same salary, lower cost of living, AND the abilit…

150k sounds way low for the Bay Area you can get that in other much less expensive metro areas.

[deleted]

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#73
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People often tell me, "Yeah the Bay Area is expensive but the tech salaries make up for it." By being able to get a Bay Area salary (e.g. $150k/year) while working from anywhere in the world (e.g. any city where $40k/year is considered comfortable living and $80k/year is considered "well off"), the incentive to continue saturating the area with local talent decreases. Same salary, lower cost of living, AND the abilit…

150k sounds way low for the Bay Area you can get that in other much less expensive metro areas.

Does it? Are you including vested stock at a large company? The proportion of talent in the Bay Area is the same - from my experience interviewing people - in other tech hubs.

Edit: made less jerky

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#74
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basecamp is selling all over the world. What should their salary level be like? Bay Area because that’s where a lot of the larger tech companies are situated? Washington State (Microsoft, Amazon)? Copenhagen (where one founder, DHH is from)? Sudney where one major competitor, Jira, is from? I’d say whatever the market is that they hire in. If you wanna pay above market rate, by all means do that. If you can attract e…

Because all companies are competing with Bay Area companies when it comes to recruiting.

I think that is changing, as more opening in Seattle, Washington, New York, Boston, Denver and Austin. If I am based in SF/North Cal, yeah, I am okay working in Bay area. Since Bay area is getting more expensive to recruit, companies seem to be more willing to accept more remote workers (but usually limited to senior positions).

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#75
I agree that many companies should pay more competitive salaries , but doesn't this disproportionately hurt people in higher cost of living areas? Everyone else gets a pay increase, the company's bottom line tightens, and higher cost of living area folks get nothing for it. I live in an area with a relatively low cost of living, and the only way I would consider moving elsewhere would be if the salary were increased proportionately to that higher cost of living such that I could maintain a similar level of comfort (beach+not negative degree temperatures ~ a couple $K).

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#76

I agree that many companies should pay more competitive salaries , but doesn't this disproportionately hurt people in higher cost of living areas? Everyone else gets a pay increase, the company's bottom line tightens, and higher cost of living area folks get nothing for it. I live in an area with a relatively low cost of living, and the only way I would consider moving elsewhere would be if the salary were increased…

But this could be seen from another POV: if you live in a high cost region, it’s your choice. Is it worth it?

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#77
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People often tell me, "Yeah the Bay Area is expensive but the tech salaries make up for it." By being able to get a Bay Area salary (e.g. $150k/year) while working from anywhere in the world (e.g. any city where $40k/year is considered comfortable living and $80k/year is considered "well off"), the incentive to continue saturating the area with local talent decreases. Same salary, lower cost of living, AND the abilit…

150k sounds way low for the Bay Area you can get that in other much less expensive metro areas.

No way on this earth, $150,000 is anywhere near normal in the Bay Area, let alone in other less expensive metros. Most people are absolutely not making that much money writing code. People have serious tunnel vision on HN.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#78
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basecamp is selling all over the world. What should their salary level be like? Bay Area because that’s where a lot of the larger tech companies are situated? Washington State (Microsoft, Amazon)? Copenhagen (where one founder, DHH is from)? Sudney where one major competitor, Jira, is from? I’d say whatever the market is that they hire in. If you wanna pay above market rate, by all means do that. If you can attract e…

People often tell me, "Yeah the Bay Area is expensive but the tech salaries make up for it." By being able to get a Bay Area salary (e.g. $150k/year) while working from anywhere in the world (e.g. any city where $40k/year is considered comfortable living and $80k/year is considered "well off"), the incentive to continue saturating the area with local talent decreases. Same salary, lower cost of living, AND the abilit…

"Yeah the Bay Area is expensive but the tech salaries make up for it."

This could be good for people who send some money back home (e.g. Indians). If you have a high number is absolute terms, then you can send more money to family.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#79
post #70

DHH has the coolest desk and home office I've ever seen: https://www.instagram.com/p/BcnPtAwlAKe/?hl=en&taken-by=dhh7... Check out the rest of the house too, amazing. I think some people have this image that Basecamp and DHH is some scrappy bootstrapper fighting the establishment. But really he is living the life that even most successful "exited" venture fueled founders wouldn't be able to attain, and he's just sayi…

Instagram bragging is so incredibly cliche at this point that it actually makes me sad for those who engage in or with it. It's like a race to see who can appear more desperate for the approval of strangers.

People with money have nice things. I don't think anybody is surprised by this. DHH is also someone that people want to follow, whether for Rails, or business, or whatever. It's not necessarily bragging. I don't know much of anything about DHH's personality, so maybe it is, maybe it isn't.

But come on, the dude is loaded. Is he supposed to move his desk to the other side of the room so that people don't carp on him for "bragging?"

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#80
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basecamp is selling all over the world. What should their salary level be like? Bay Area because that’s where a lot of the larger tech companies are situated? Washington State (Microsoft, Amazon)? Copenhagen (where one founder, DHH is from)? Sudney where one major competitor, Jira, is from? I’d say whatever the market is that they hire in. If you wanna pay above market rate, by all means do that. If you can attract e…

People often tell me, "Yeah the Bay Area is expensive but the tech salaries make up for it." By being able to get a Bay Area salary (e.g. $150k/year) while working from anywhere in the world (e.g. any city where $40k/year is considered comfortable living and $80k/year is considered "well off"), the incentive to continue saturating the area with local talent decreases. Same salary, lower cost of living, AND the abilit…

Well if companies can be have absurd valuations (or even, gasp, be profitable) while paying Bay Area salaries, it makes sense to me to expect to be paid as if you're working in the Bay Area. After all you produce pretty much the same amount of value whether you sit in SF or in Bukarest.
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