Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

discussions.apple.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

291–300 of 340 posts

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#291

Post by carterehsmith »

nl wrote: post #279
carterehsmith wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm that does not seem to be fighting the MBP... more like fighting the $1000-$1300 HPs, Dells, and so on E.g. http://www.techradar.com/reviews/xiaomi-mi-notebook-pro/2

Well it’s a windows laptop, so yes they say what else you can get that is directly comparable. It’s the price of the midrange Windows laptops, but the specs and build quality of the MacBooks. The downside is Windows of course. But it is supposed to work pretty well under Linux.

>> It’s the price of the midrange Windows laptops, but the specs and build quality of the MacBooks.

"specs and build quality of the MacBooks"? Great, can we see that mythical laptop that is 3-4x cheaper than equivalently-specced MBP or not? Url?

Or is it just empty talk?

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#292

Post by alwillis »

dchuk wrote: post #99
ohthehugemanate wrote: post #61

Apple went from building fantastically reliable software on beautiful, powerful devices, to... Well, this. Even die hard apple fans don't use their built in apps for calendar, music, mail, or really anything, because the design is so bloated. Their hardware performance lags the rest of the market at their price point, and skirt the lines of programmed obsolescence. And now apparently their major OS updates go out wit…

Anecdotally, I've been running High Sierra Betas for a few months now and have experienced zero issues. I'm also a die hard apple fan that uses all of the built in apps except for Music (I prefer Spotify). One data point.

Same here—running the latest public beta of High Sierra 10.13.3 on a 9-year old iMac with no problems.

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#293

Post by nl »

carterehsmith wrote: post #291
nl wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well it’s a windows laptop, so yes they say what else you can get that is directly comparable. It’s the price of the midrange Windows laptops, but the specs and build quality of the MacBooks. The downside is Windows of course. But it is supposed to work pretty well under Linux.

>> It’s the price of the midrange Windows laptops, but the specs and build quality of the MacBooks. "specs and build quality of the MacBooks"? Great, can we see that mythical laptop that is 3-4x cheaper than equivalently-specced MBP or not? Url? Or is it just empty talk?

Why the hostility?

I think it’s more like 2.5 to 3 times cheaper than 3 to 4, but it’s pretty easy to find.

A$1400: https://www.lightinthebox.com/xiaomi-laptop-15-6-inch-intel-....

Vs

A$3500: https://www.apple.com/au/shop/buy-mac/macbook-pro?product=MP... (with weaker CPU and GPU)

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#294

Post by willhackett »

I thought it was just me. But to see so many people disappointed with the decline in quality of macOS and accompanying products is somewhat comforting—at least from the potential standpoint that Apple may make some response.

I've been a die-hard Apple user since moving from Windows in 2009. I'm even powered by MobileMe from the days where you paid for your sync. Nothing has changed much since then.

I find myself watching things like the Essentials Phone and Google's secretive desktop operating system for some escape from the Apple ecosystem. I love the hardware. I love the support. But the symphony of hardware and software working together as one isn't as special as it used to be.

The desktop apps are inconsistent and distant to their iOS cousins. The experiences in the apps seems hinged on a time long past. Newer "features" in the operating system feel tacked on—not working effectively. I know they don't want to merge iOS and macOS—but I feel they have a better grasp on what's going on behind iOS than Mac. Perhaps it's time to put Mac out of its misery and bring iOS a little bit of Mac—terminal, filesystem and more.

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#295

Post by veidr »

zemvpferreira wrote: post #277
api wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a reason innovative work always seems to feature such insane burn out? You hear it everywhere you see really major strides being made. The thing I find disturbing is that moving slower doesn't just result in the thing coming slower. It seems to result in never shipping or a lack of innovation. It's like there is some kind of activation energy that must be overcome and the effect is non linear. Real innovatio…

I suspect this is nowhere near universal as we might think. Maybe it comes from viewer’s bias or a personality flaw common to individuals obssessed enough to invent, but nothing about progress benefits from personal destruction. There must be examples of progress without pain. Did inventing the internet cause anyone grief?

> Did inventing the internet cause anyone grief?

Well it could certainly be said to have caused Al Gore some grief...

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#296

Post by makecheck »

eridius wrote: post #282
makecheck wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are tons of ways to deal with sensitive data that don’t require hiding the entire bug reporting system. One is to allow links to things that not everyone can see (e.g. internal web sites or protected repositories) but still making the bug report itself and the comment thread entirely public and searchable. A lot of times, all I really need is a quick way to understand that someone else in the universe has my pr…

The bug report and comment thread itself is sensitive. The only possible way they could do this is if there was a checkbox on externally-reported bugs saying "allow this to be public", but that will just move the goalposts, because maybe 0.0000001% of the bug reporter will end up public, and you'll still have your bugs duped to private stuff, and search will be almost entirely useless. If you want public bugs, go loo…

How can the entire report be sensitive? There’s always something that can become public, e.g. after sifting through a mountain of private data and finding Bug X in NSFooBar, file a bug on that and make that part public so the rest of us know.

Using OpenRadar regularly would even further increase the effort spent reporting bugs, and then: Apple doesn’t maintain it, Apple doesn’t check it, Apple certainly doesn’t synchronize with it, Apple does benefit greatly from it, despite Apple not accepting responsibility and providing a basic, foundational tool of its own.

This thread is starting to feel like a bug report in itself. Yes, everything behaves as I described, yes the issues were logged with Apple, yes it takes them months to respond sometimes (and I was being generous, sometimes it’s over a year), yes Xcode is still buggy in very obvious ways when doing very trivial things, and I’m even using recent Apple hardware and software.

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#297

Post by lawkwok »

ohthehugemanate wrote: post #61

Apple went from building fantastically reliable software on beautiful, powerful devices, to... Well, this. Even die hard apple fans don't use their built in apps for calendar, music, mail, or really anything, because the design is so bloated. Their hardware performance lags the rest of the market at their price point, and skirt the lines of programmed obsolescence. And now apparently their major OS updates go out wit…

I think people just have short memories. This kind of "hard freezing" is nothing new. Apple is just much more in the spotlight than ever before.

I personally had this issue with the 2010 MacBook Pro. https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2420192

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#298

Post by duncan_bayne »

ohthehugemanate wrote: post #61

Apple went from building fantastically reliable software on beautiful, powerful devices, to... Well, this. Even die hard apple fans don't use their built in apps for calendar, music, mail, or really anything, because the design is so bloated. Their hardware performance lags the rest of the market at their price point, and skirt the lines of programmed obsolescence. And now apparently their major OS updates go out wit…

I've been programming professionally since 2000, working professionally on a range of operating systems: Windows, Linux, OSX and FreeBSD. I've dabbled with Solaris SPARC back in the day, and grew up with AmsDOS and MS DOS. I've never had the pleasure of using a Lisp Machine, but enjoy Common Lisp and have a (jealous / nostalgic) feeling for what a LispM must have been like.

I mention all of this to give context to my post; I'm not writing from a position of OS ignorance.

Anyhow: I'm continually surprised by the support for proprietary operating systems and hardware amongst IT professionals in general, and programmers specifically.

I've been running a mix of Xubuntu devices (older ThinkPads for the children) and FreeBSD (for my personal laptop and the home NAS / Minecraft etc. server) and enjoying ease of deployment (simple shell scripts), low cost, high confugurability and especially high reliability in the case of FreeBSD.

Windows users used to tell me that NIX was fine, but to get a job, they needed to program for Windows. That's probably still the case in many fields, but not in the Web dev circles I frequent.

OSX users tell me that they want both performance, reliable hardware with out of the box support. These days a good XPS or X1 Carbon will eat most or all Mac systems alive, have (in my experience) better build quality, and work well with Linux out of the box.

At the company where I work there is a growing number of users who are eschewing the latest turn of the Apple upgrade merry go round and are switching to Dell and Lenovo systems w/ Linux (and FreeBSD, in my case). Everything we need to do for our client still works, and we get more control, cheaper prices and an escape from the frankly "consumer" attitude Apple has these days (imagine - a pocket computer that won't let you install software of your choice!)

So if you're in the market for something better and cheaper than Apple, I suggest you take a look at Linux (maybe Ubuntu to start with?), FreeBSD or one of the many alternatives. You might just like it :)

Edited to add: Oh yeah, and don't forget the advantage of being able to continue using devices well past the point their manufacturers wish you'd buy something new (or force you to, in the case of Apple). I recently installed FreeBSD on a 16 year old laptop as an experiment, and it works fine. Slow, sure, but fast enough to run Emacs, Firefox, and Ruby. In a (frustrating) pinch I could probably do around half of my daily work on it.

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#299

Post by Khaine »

minusf wrote: post #165
christoph wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s APFS that’s the cause of my biggest frustration, but I’ve not seen anyone else complain about. I normally run with about 50gb free space. After three to four days, I’m normally down to about 3gb and nothing will get it to show back up, other than a reboot. I’ve even run a test which supports this - downloaded 35gb of files, deleted them and emptied the trash. Same thing... space is missing till I reboot.

time machine local backups cannot be disabled anymore (was possible in sierra). these backups are going to a hidden volume and can be listed with the tmutil(8) command. it is not possible to delete all local snapshots with a single command either, the delete subcommand takes a single date... for this reason i do only on-demand backups when i connect my external backup drive. another worrying thing is that the time ma…

I'm not sure why you are worrying. APFS doesn't checksum data, only file metadata. So its barely better than HFS+ in terms of data integrity

Re: High Sierra macOS freezing and stops

#300

Post by minusf »

Khaine wrote: post #299
minusf wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

time machine local backups cannot be disabled anymore (was possible in sierra). these backups are going to a hidden volume and can be listed with the tmutil(8) command. it is not possible to delete all local snapshots with a single command either, the delete subcommand takes a single date... for this reason i do only on-demand backups when i connect my external backup drive. another worrying thing is that the time ma…

I'm not sure why you are worrying. APFS doesn't checksum data, only file metadata. So its barely better than HFS+ in terms of data integrity

my worry is backing up from FS A to FS B where these file systems are not feature equal. just the fact that you cannot use APFS to backup APFS is worrying to me.
Post reply on HN