Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage • Hacker News Board

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#11

Post by cik2e » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:37 AM UTC

an4rchy wrote: post #5

I've been wondering about this for a while but, is there a reason why Uber or an alternative cannot/should not get into the Ambulance space, if it were able to get qualified staff. I feel like Ambulances/Hospitals charge way too much and using the app/tech at a basic level to connect the ambulances with patients addresses may be a good start for everyone and also the increase in supply may reduce costs.

There are already private services for medical transport, although I do not know if they are allowed to handle emergencies.

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#12

Post by Spooky23 » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:38 AM UTC

bmelton wrote: post #7

If you don't get bogged down in details of the service, I see this as generally net good. For many, ambulance rides are prohibitively expensive, and while I certainly wouldn't be cost-conscious taking an ambulance in the event of a seizure or heart attack, for something like a broken arm, or non-life-threatening ailment, an Uber/Lyft/Cab is a good alternative to trying to drive myself. Beyond that, I'd like to see st…

NYFD has about 220 ALS units (advanced / requiring a paramedic) and 550 BLS (basic transport, no drugs, etc) units per day.

Reducing BLS calls via uber wouldn’t affect availability of ALS units for serious things, but would probably save money.

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#13

Post by TylerE » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:39 AM UTC

switch007 wrote: post #9

an4rchy wrote: post #5

I've been wondering about this for a while but, is there a reason why Uber or an alternative cannot/should not get into the Ambulance space, if it were able to get qualified staff. I feel like Ambulances/Hospitals charge way too much and using the app/tech at a basic level to connect the ambulances with patients addresses may be a good start for everyone and also the increase in supply may reduce costs.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

Not really. There are plenty of private ambulance services in the US. They generally deal with things like transporting a medically frail person to see a doctor in a different city, things like that. Non emergency, mostly.

http://www.nytimes.com/1987/01/31/style/private-ambulances-w... (yes, over 30 years old, but most of it still holds true)

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#14

Post by Spooky23 » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:39 AM UTC

switch007 wrote: post #9

an4rchy wrote: post #5

I've been wondering about this for a while but, is there a reason why Uber or an alternative cannot/should not get into the Ambulance space, if it were able to get qualified staff. I feel like Ambulances/Hospitals charge way too much and using the app/tech at a basic level to connect the ambulances with patients addresses may be a good start for everyone and also the increase in supply may reduce costs.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

Nah, there’s certification and usually contracts with municipalities for response to emergencies.

It’s a real mix though... paid fire dapartments, volunteers, and private operators all respond to emergencies.

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#15

Post by adventured » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:39 AM UTC

switch007 wrote: post #9

an4rchy wrote: post #5

I've been wondering about this for a while but, is there a reason why Uber or an alternative cannot/should not get into the Ambulance space, if it were able to get qualified staff. I feel like Ambulances/Hospitals charge way too much and using the app/tech at a basic level to connect the ambulances with patients addresses may be a good start for everyone and also the increase in supply may reduce costs.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

There are a lot of private ambulance services in the US, they're anything but unregulated though as you'd expect with anything in the US medical field (one of the most regulated industries on earth).

There's no theoretical reason why Uber couldn't get into the driving side of the business, with human drivers. Their future is in autonomous however, which will never be the ambulance business (it will never be autonomous, ambulance drivers frequently have to break standard driving laws in emergencies, drive at high speeds, drive around vehicles, etc).

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#16

Post by TylerE » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:48 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #15

switch007 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

There are a lot of private ambulance services in the US, they're anything but unregulated though as you'd expect with anything in the US medical field (one of the most regulated industries on earth). There's no theoretical reason why Uber couldn't get into the driving side of the business, with human drivers. Their future is in autonomous however, which will never be the ambulance business (it will never be autonomou…

Once automation gets good enough it'll probably be better at it then human drivers (imagine weaving through traffic, that sort of thing. It would also be able to do things like reroute in real time to avoid congestion.

You'll still need warm bodies in the back for life support, but I see no reason that the human in the front seat can't be replaced by sufficiently advanced technology.

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#17

Post by switch007 » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:51 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #15

switch007 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

There are a lot of private ambulance services in the US, they're anything but unregulated though as you'd expect with anything in the US medical field (one of the most regulated industries on earth). There's no theoretical reason why Uber couldn't get into the driving side of the business, with human drivers. Their future is in autonomous however, which will never be the ambulance business (it will never be autonomou…

> It will never be autonomous, ambulance drivers frequently have to break standard driving laws in emergencies, drive at high speeds, drive around vehicles, etc).

And because they have to perform emergency medical treatment, right?!

Are we talking about different things - a mini hospital on wheels staffed by highly trained paramedics, and glorified taxis for the elderly/non-critical?

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#18

Post by Cyphase » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:51 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #15

switch007 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

There are a lot of private ambulance services in the US, they're anything but unregulated though as you'd expect with anything in the US medical field (one of the most regulated industries on earth). There's no theoretical reason why Uber couldn't get into the driving side of the business, with human drivers. Their future is in autonomous however, which will never be the ambulance business (it will never be autonomou…

Never is a really strong word, especially when you italicize it.

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#19

Post by dsacco » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:51 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #15

switch007 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

There are a lot of private ambulance services in the US, they're anything but unregulated though as you'd expect with anything in the US medical field (one of the most regulated industries on earth). There's no theoretical reason why Uber couldn't get into the driving side of the business, with human drivers. Their future is in autonomous however, which will never be the ambulance business (it will never be autonomou…

> Their future is in autonomous however, which will never be the ambulance business (it will never be autonomous, ambulance drivers frequently have to break standard driving laws in emergencies, drive at high speeds, drive around vehicles, etc).

None of these are reasons for ambulances to not be autonomous. If you accept that most other vehicles will be fully autonomous, ambulances do not require anything further extraordinary to also be autonomous. The vehicles on the road would likely be networked, at least within a nexus of proximity, and move out of the way of the ambulance so it could speed past them.

NB: I’m not saying ambulances will be autonomous. I’m just saying that if everything else is, the ambulances have no significant (technical) obstacle for also being autonomous either. A significant theoretical advantage of fully autonomous vehicles is not simply that the modal vehicle is safer than a human, but that a networked and autonomous fleet is hyper-efficient and hyper-aware as a hive mind.

Re: Cities with Uber Have Lower Rates of Ambulance Usage

#20

Post by switch007 » Tue, Dec 26, 2017, 2:58 AM UTC

TylerE wrote: post #13

switch007 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are paramedics/ambulances so unregulated in the US that it's /not/ a bat-shit crazy idea to suggest Uber Ambulances?

Not really. There are plenty of private ambulance services in the US. They generally deal with things like transporting a medically frail person to see a doctor in a different city, things like that. Non emergency, mostly. http://www.nytimes.com/1987/01/31/style/private-ambulances-w... (yes, over 30 years old, but most of it still holds true)

Thanks for the link!