Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

agnnews.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 41 posts

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#11

Post by ciconia »

dogma1138 wrote: post #3

This what happens when a basic sedan like a Volkswagen Passat plug-in starts at 450,000 NOK ($54,000), once you add even basic customization, fees and all the rest the on the road cost of a mid range sedan could be as much as Tesla 75d, since many Teslas come to Norway as secondary imports there are plenty of “refurbished” Model S 60d’s for less than that. Don’t get me wrong it’s neat that this is the case but this i…

Why ridiculous? After all, it's been put in place for the express purpose of reducing greenhouse gas emissions [1], and at least in Norway it seems to be effective.

[1] https://ec.europa.eu/clima/policies/transport/vehicles/cars_...

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#12

Post by jacquesm »

The high sales in December 2017 are easily explained because of the one-off tax proposed for 2018:

https://www.ft.com/content/fe6b79d4-af31-11e7-aab9-abaa44b1e...

Once Norway drops the tax advantages for EVs which is projected to happen somewhere past 2020 likely they'll be back to 'normal' quite quickly.

Also, this is for new sales, the bulk of the fleet is still ICE's (68%), with the majority made up by VW, Toyota and Volvo.

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#13

Post by apcragg »

gnarbarian wrote: post #10
dogma1138 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing to do with being forward thinking it’s about money. When you can buy a Tesla for the same price or cheaper and a bloody Volkswagen Passat you are going to buy a Tesla. The Passat which in the US would cost you $20,000 has an on road price which starts at around $60,000 in Norway and most versions would cost you $70-75K.

Yep. Norway discourages gas powered vehicle ownership through miles of red tape and taxes.

Is that a bad thing though? Are they just pricing in the externalities of gas powered cars?

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#14

Post by deepsun »

hurrdurr wrote: post #8

This is a repeat of a prior Tesla publicity stunt. What they do is they only ship cars to Norway quarterly, and by filling a big backlog of orders they then claim to be the most popular make in that month, which is technically true but also quite silly. You can clearly see on the graph in the article that the reason Tesla "sold" a ton of cars in September is because it sold almost none in August and July prior. And T…

Tesla is also subsidized by government, so it costs pretty much the same as a "general" kind of family car.

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#15

Post by dogma1138 »

gnarbarian wrote: post #10
dogma1138 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing to do with being forward thinking it’s about money. When you can buy a Tesla for the same price or cheaper and a bloody Volkswagen Passat you are going to buy a Tesla. The Passat which in the US would cost you $20,000 has an on road price which starts at around $60,000 in Norway and most versions would cost you $70-75K.

Yep. Norway discourages gas powered vehicle ownership through miles of red tape and taxes.

It discourages ownership of any vehicle, it just affects EVs currently less. Norway didn’t implement those policies to encourage EVs due to how the laws and regulations were structured they just sliped through, and this won’t last for much longer there has been quite a bit of talk of closing some of the loopholes and cutting some of the subsidies.

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#16

Post by _0w8t »

In Oslo people complain that rich people in suburbs get Tesla just to avoid traffic jams and use public transport lines that electrical cars can also use. Yet for less fortunate folks who needs a family car non-electric cars are still the only option money wise.

In principle they have a point. As battery is still extremely expensive it is cheaper to make a plugin hybrid that can drive like 50 kilometers on a battery and uses small engine to get a bigger range. In practical usage such car will be 95% electric yet cheaper than pure electric with range of, say, 300 km. Yet in Norway only electrical cars have zero taxes. The tax insensitives for plugins are relatively minor and do not compensate for price increase due to more complex power train. So people looking for a bigger family car often get a gasoline or disel car.

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#17

Post by widforss »

moomin wrote: post #4

The funny thing is, if there’s a country that practically would adopt electric cars last, it would be Norway. It’s got large distances and low prevailing temperatures, neither of which are favourable to electric cars. That’s how it would go if countries were equal. However, Norway’s a fairly enlightened and forward thinking place, so politically it’s not surprising they’re way ahead of the curve.

But a third fact is true of Norway. You don't drive very far because of the geography. Instead, the market for domestic flights is booming.

If you live in a country where you don't drive your car outside your county (sligth exaggeration there), there's no need for fossil fuel.

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#18

Post by dogma1138 »

ciconia wrote: post #11
dogma1138 wrote: post #3

This what happens when a basic sedan like a Volkswagen Passat plug-in starts at 450,000 NOK ($54,000), once you add even basic customization, fees and all the rest the on the road cost of a mid range sedan could be as much as Tesla 75d, since many Teslas come to Norway as secondary imports there are plenty of “refurbished” Model S 60d’s for less than that. Don’t get me wrong it’s neat that this is the case but this i…

Why ridiculous? After all, it's been put in place for the express purpose of reducing greenhouse gas emissions [1], and at least in Norway it seems to be effective. [1] https://ec.europa.eu/clima/policies/transport/vehicles/cars_...

Because it didn’t, it was hugely biased against CO2 emissions only which allowed the European favored Diesel engines to appear much less polluting.

On top of that the policy focused heavily on engine “size” which again favored Diesel engines and vehicle weight which effectively screwed over early plugin hybrids and currently screws over large families and luxury cars.

The weight and capacity policy has also been abused to make luxury and performance cars considerably more expensive despite being more economical and less polluting at road speeds.

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#19

Post by seanmcdirmid »

moomin wrote: post #4

The funny thing is, if there’s a country that practically would adopt electric cars last, it would be Norway. It’s got large distances and low prevailing temperatures, neither of which are favourable to electric cars. That’s how it would go if countries were equal. However, Norway’s a fairly enlightened and forward thinking place, so politically it’s not surprising they’re way ahead of the curve.

Norway also has abundant hydro electricity. EV use makes a lot of sense in that context.

Re: Tesla becomes most popular automaker in Norway

#20

Post by aisofteng »

hurrdurr wrote: post #8

This is a repeat of a prior Tesla publicity stunt. What they do is they only ship cars to Norway quarterly, and by filling a big backlog of orders they then claim to be the most popular make in that month, which is technically true but also quite silly. You can clearly see on the graph in the article that the reason Tesla "sold" a ton of cars in September is because it sold almost none in August and July prior. And T…

That said, if you walk around Oslo you really do see quite a lot of Teslas on the road; it's noticeable.
Post reply on HN