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Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

nytimes.com

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Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#91

Post by brlewis »

nxsynonym wrote: post #28
bluGill wrote: post #25

Unfortunately while there is evidence that sitting all day is bad, we don't know if/what alternatives are good. Is standing better, or do you need to move? Maybe it is staring at something close (monitor, papers...) and sitting is only bad as a proxy (I know of no study that can actually say that hypothesis is wrong even though I just made it up). Modern life currently requires a lot of people to spend a lot of time…

I think the only real alternative is to get rid of the 8+ hour work day. Correct me if there is evidence to the contrary, but I don't think humans were designed to sit or stand in one position for extended periods of time, habitually. Unfortunately I don't see the 8 hour work day going away any time soon, so imo the best option is to alternate sitting/standing and take as many walking around breaks as possible.

> the best option is to alternate sitting/standing and take as many walking around breaks as possible.

Agreed. This works great for me.

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#92

Post by abawany »

anken wrote: post #83
abawany wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I place this ( http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/90184047/ ) on my desk when I want a standing desk and remove it when I am ready to sit down :) . I like Ikea.

I place this https://m.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/art/80267566/ on my desk, you can put more things than your computer and lean on it, it holds well.

That's a good idea - the Marius table that I use is a bit precarious with its round top.

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#93

Post by lucaspiller »

Florin_Andrei wrote: post #76
sixdimensional wrote: post #41

Taking a bigger picture view, this makes me wonder.. we took so much effort to move from the industrial age, where hands on work, always active all day work took its toll on workers, to the service or knowledge age, where we sit all day and that takes its toll. Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move, and the amount of each must be relative to each person and activity. I would…

> Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move I think the biggest change we made that caught us completely unprepared, was that we've committed ourselves to doing the same thing 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, all year long, for decades. I don't think our bodies evolved for this kind of effort (and I use the word "effort" even when the activity requires a lot of sitting, which is ap…

I often read comments here comparing our lives to hunter-gatherers, but something to bear in mind is most humans haven’t lived like that for many thousands of years. We may have evolved from that, but our bodies are very different to the people who lived like that. Farming has been around for a long time, and a lot of that involves doing the same repetive tasks all day long, and having a relatively stable supply of food.

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#94

Post by the_af »

CM30 wrote: post #55
sixdimensional wrote: post #41

Taking a bigger picture view, this makes me wonder.. we took so much effort to move from the industrial age, where hands on work, always active all day work took its toll on workers, to the service or knowledge age, where we sit all day and that takes its toll. Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move, and the amount of each must be relative to each person and activity. I would…

Stick the computer on an exercise bike, set it up so its powered by a dynamo and get the programming, marketing and sales teams to cycle while working. Okay, that's not a good idea, but it's one I can see a executive coming up with to 'promote a healthy lifestyle' at one of those newfangled offices Apple and Google and the likes have.

> Stick the computer on an exercise bike, set it up so its powered by a dynamo and get the programming, marketing and sales teams to cycle while working.

I liked that Black Mirror episode.

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#95

Post by tomcooks »

sixdimensional wrote: post #41

Taking a bigger picture view, this makes me wonder.. we took so much effort to move from the industrial age, where hands on work, always active all day work took its toll on workers, to the service or knowledge age, where we sit all day and that takes its toll. Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move, and the amount of each must be relative to each person and activity. I would…

I found out that most doctor's advice is so sane and blunt nobody listens to it. You need something more clickbaitish and with a catchy name like paleofit, restcharging or standoori

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#96

Post by Florin_Andrei »

slphil wrote: post #90
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move I think the biggest change we made that caught us completely unprepared, was that we've committed ourselves to doing the same thing 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, all year long, for decades. I don't think our bodies evolved for this kind of effort (and I use the word "effort" even when the activity requires a lot of sitting, which is ap…

While nothing you said is inaccurate, be careful of falling for the "original affluent society" canard. Hunter gatherers do not work less than we do, and they do not get enough food. (Quillette recently did a good write-up on this.)

Right. Something that modern society is good at is smoothing out random variations. After a local catastrophe, the rest of the country (or, sometimes, the world) will lend you a helping hand nowadays. But back then, your whole tribe would get wiped out.

Similar for non-life-threatening events. Food input decrease in your area? You barely notice it in the somewhat higher prices, because society is routing food to you from other places. But your hunter-gatherer ancestors would be hungry for days or weeks.

We're better adapted for a harsh, variable environment, and it's funny how our cozy, temperature-controlled dwellings are causing a whole host of new issues.

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#97

Post by Florin_Andrei »

lucaspiller wrote: post #93
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move I think the biggest change we made that caught us completely unprepared, was that we've committed ourselves to doing the same thing 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, all year long, for decades. I don't think our bodies evolved for this kind of effort (and I use the word "effort" even when the activity requires a lot of sitting, which is ap…

I often read comments here comparing our lives to hunter-gatherers, but something to bear in mind is most humans haven’t lived like that for many thousands of years. We may have evolved from that, but our bodies are very different to the people who lived like that. Farming has been around for a long time, and a lot of that involves doing the same repetive tasks all day long, and having a relatively stable supply of f…

> our bodies are very different to the people who lived like that

True, but I think the differences can still be explained 99% by changes in lifestyle. Genetically we are still overwhelmingly similar - with a few tiny differences like lactose tolerance, etc.

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#98

Post by lfowles »

_m8fo wrote: post #5

I dunno if sitting is bad or not -- but ever since I got a fitted desk and put a Deskcycle under it I've felt super great. It's a bit awkward always being a little bit sweaty though (I put in ~50 miles a day). https://deskcycle.com/

I had one at my old job, but my current desk is too short to use it without bonking my knees.

If interested, I made a little tool to gather cadence data on a computer instead of using the provided monitor: https://github.com/lfowles/deskcycle

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#99

Post by adrice727 »

slphil wrote: post #90
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move I think the biggest change we made that caught us completely unprepared, was that we've committed ourselves to doing the same thing 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, all year long, for decades. I don't think our bodies evolved for this kind of effort (and I use the word "effort" even when the activity requires a lot of sitting, which is ap…

While nothing you said is inaccurate, be careful of falling for the "original affluent society" canard. Hunter gatherers do not work less than we do, and they do not get enough food. (Quillette recently did a good write-up on this.)

The article you're referring to[1] only talks about a single group of hunter-gatherers, the !Kung. And all things considered, they do not work less than we do.

. . . his original estimate of 12-19 hours worked per week did not include food processing, tool making, or general housework, and when such activities were included he estimated that the !Kung worked about 40-44 hours per week.

How many people do you know that spend 44 hours or less per week working, commuting, grocery shopping, cooking, doing housework, running errands, etc.?

[1] http://quillette.com/2017/12/16/romanticizing-hunter-gathere...

Re: Sitting May Be Bad for Your Heart

#100

Post by jacobolus »

lucaspiller wrote: post #93
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Surely the answer lies somewhere in-between, that we must rest, and we must move I think the biggest change we made that caught us completely unprepared, was that we've committed ourselves to doing the same thing 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, all year long, for decades. I don't think our bodies evolved for this kind of effort (and I use the word "effort" even when the activity requires a lot of sitting, which is ap…

I often read comments here comparing our lives to hunter-gatherers, but something to bear in mind is most humans haven’t lived like that for many thousands of years. We may have evolved from that, but our bodies are very different to the people who lived like that. Farming has been around for a long time, and a lot of that involves doing the same repetive tasks all day long, and having a relatively stable supply of f…

Not so much “evolved” changes, but human bodies definitely undergo differences in shape depending on use and context. Just look at athletes who start playing different sports from a young age – some of the difference is genetic and selection effects, but training definitely also affects muscle mass, joint flexibility, etc.

The nutrient-deficient and unvaried diet, poor hygiene/concentration of people, and difficult menial workload from farming gave us very high infant mortality rate, higher disease rate, shrinking height and all sorts of health problems, repetitive strain leading to bodies just completely worn out by age 50, etc.

As people started eating better etc. after getting away from a peasant lifestyle, average height increased by 30cm, infant mortality went way down, life expectancy and quality of life for elderly people went way up, etc.

Our bodies to some extent started reverting to their “natural” shape, but of course being bottle-fed, wearing rigid shoes, sitting inside all day staring at close work from birth onward, a diet with increasing amounts of refined sugar/starch and plenty of alcohol etc. has certainly had its physical effects, and is leaving us with small jaws, dental caries, warped feet, inflexible ankles (unable to squat e.g.), decreasing levels of physical strength, back problems, diabetes, dementia in old age, ....

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