Live data from Hacker News

Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

cbc.ca

81–89 of 89 posts

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#81
post #68

I have an unpublished, unfinished PhD thesis investigating this question. I'm working on getting permission to publish it, but for now I can only give you the summary. The author administered standardised personality tests to people tested as fluently bi-lingual in English and German. Each of the four possibilities was tested. Everyone got both tests, some tested first in English, the others first in German. Each gro…

Why do you need permission to post your own writing? Do you sign some kind of NDA when you enter a phd program?

It's not mine, and it's a long story. The short version is that a chap I know - nowin his 70s - never finished his PhD. We were chatting about the SWH and linguistic relativism and he mentioned it. I asked to see it, he loaned it to me - with permission to copy - provided I never made any of it public.

I'm slowly trying to persuade him that it wouldn't be a bad thing, but it's slow work. He also has the early symptoms of Alzheimer's, so it may never happen.

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#82

I have an unpublished, unfinished PhD thesis investigating this question. I'm working on getting permission to publish it, but for now I can only give you the summary. The author administered standardised personality tests to people tested as fluently bi-lingual in English and German. Each of the four possibilities was tested. Everyone got both tests, some tested first in English, the others first in German. Each gro…

Here's a bit of my experience to back up how hard it is to separate out the cultural aspect: The English singular 'you' has two words for it in German, 'sie' and 'du'. The first one is used in situations where there is some distance between the speakers, the second when they are (much) more familiar. It used to be fairly unheard of to hear a German 'subordinate' use 'du' to their superior, whereas in English it would…

But English has rules too. Not as clear cut as German, but you wouldn't say 'sup mate?' to you boss, you use a different vocabulary when talking to a superior.

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#83
post #78
post #4

I speak 2 languages fluently and a few others adequately. I definitely think my behavior is a little different when speaking Spanish versus English, but I don't think there are any deep-seated psycholinguistic reasons for this - it's more because of cultural differences. An example: in Colombia, when demonstrating the height of a child, you hold your hand vertically, while when talking about the height of an animal,…

"English, a more unemotional and efficient language than Spanish" That claim is because it is usually perceived that lots of words and expressions in English are shorter than their Spanish counterparts. car vs carro dog vs perro lol vs que risa jajajajaja I'm really interested in an expert explanation of why this is complete bullshit.

First: it's because it's making cultural observations about the people from both places, and trying to somehow say that this is reflected in the language.

For the sake of argument, let's just assume the British are "less emotional" than the Argentines (though attending a football match in each country may disabuse you of that idea). This may affect the way people use language, but it does not affect language. Language is a tool that people use to convey their thoughts. The tool not affected by the thoughts it is used to convey.

Second: sure, English may have lots of one-syllable words for things that are two syllables in Spanish (though the "lol" example you gave above is spurious because in my experience people just write "jaja."). But English requires more use of pronouns, articles and prepositions than Spanish does:

* "No sé" vs. "I don't know"

* "No lo vi" vs. "I didn't see it"

* "vamos" vs. "let's go"

* "saco la mano" "I take out my hand"

What's more "efficient?" It's subjective, and at the end of the day an utterly meaningless thing to analyze because trying to extrapolate cultural behaviors from the way a language uses propositions and articles is about as good science as phrenology or astrology.

Third: let's assume when people say "efficient" they mean "simpler grammar." People often claim that "Latin is more complex than English" because it has nominal declensions. But because of its declensions, word order in Latin is almost irrelevant. In place of declensions, English uses strict word order to distinguish subjects from objects. Which one is simpler? It's subjective, because your answer will depend on whether you're a native speaker of a language more like Latin or more like English.

But if you're writing a program to parse natural language syntax, Latin's "complex" nouns make it a lot easier to parse programmatically than English. What does this say about Roman culture? Nothing. Again, it's the wrong way to look at language - there's no valid reason to draw a connection between grammar and cultural behavior.

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#84
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice paper. what is Atof, Inc.?

Just my company... essentially it's what I do all my work through, makes life easier than doing things as a sole proprietor.

very interesting. can you tell me more? what kind of work do you do?

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#85
post #39

I've always been of the belief that cognition is deeply rooted in language. This is essentially the Sapir-Wharf hypothesis.

Not exactly. Everbody agrees that cognition and language are interconnected. But the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis is a little more specific.

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#86
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So is 170° too hot for coffee? I still don't quite get it. is that Fahrenheit, or Celsius (the latter probably physically impossible, but still)? What temperature is coffee now (at McD and at Starbucks?)? Feeling sorry for someone doesn't appear to be beneficial to people's judgement.

Fahrenheit. Yes, it is too hot; home-brewed coffee is ~140 degrees. McDonalds was warned multiple times, at least once by a burn victims' society, that their coffee was dangerously hot prior to this case but chose to do nothing about it. I don't know the exact temperatures that McDonalds & Starbucks currently serve their coffee at, but that specific McDonalds franchise lowered the temp by ~10 degrees afterwards, and…

Yet, the jury put part of the blame on her, and further attempts to sue corporations for serving (or making) hot coffee has gone nowhere. The temperature issue is probably just a legal McGuffin here; in reality, she got the money because McDonalds blew it in the first round, when they refused to contribute to her actual costs.

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#87
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"people in Berlin yell at each other all the time to resolve conflicts" Oh, I thought the real German stereotype was that you sued people if they annoyed you even the slightest.

That's American.

Nah, it's actually true for Germany too (where do you think the Americans got the idea? :-), but I guess you hear enough stories about German lawsuits over there as I do here...

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#88
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fahrenheit. Yes, it is too hot; home-brewed coffee is ~140 degrees. McDonalds was warned multiple times, at least once by a burn victims' society, that their coffee was dangerously hot prior to this case but chose to do nothing about it. I don't know the exact temperatures that McDonalds & Starbucks currently serve their coffee at, but that specific McDonalds franchise lowered the temp by ~10 degrees afterwards, and…

Yet, the jury put part of the blame on her, and further attempts to sue corporations for serving (or making) hot coffee has gone nowhere. The temperature issue is probably just a legal McGuffin here; in reality, she got the money because McDonalds blew it in the first round, when they refused to contribute to her actual costs.

I'm no lawyer, so I'll take your word on the legal aspects. But from an ethical perspective, I think the temperature of the coffee is important. They intentionally sold a dangerous product. The woman's only faults were being kind of clumsy and assuming that the "hot" coffee was ouch-hot, not ER-hot. 140 degree coffee is ouch-hot, and serving coffee so hot it would injure you if you tried to drink it right away is absurd.

Juries are just people, and people blame victims of things all the time.

Re: Do you have a different personality when you speak a different language?

#89
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's American.

Nah, it's actually true for Germany too (where do you think the Americans got the idea? :-), but I guess you hear enough stories about German lawsuits over there as I do here...

s/enough/as many/
Post reply on HN