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Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

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Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#201

Post by jjeaff »

jakupovic wrote: post #197
forgotpassagan wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For technical reasons, Bitcoin honestly sucks. The block rate is so low that transactions cost many dollars and take hours to confirm. This is only going to continue to get worse, as it turns out that having a global ledger is actually the opposite of a decentralized system. I can't do anything with Bitcoin that I can't do more easily with my credit card. It offers no value except a tool for rampant speculation. Bloc…

'I can't do anything with Bitcoin that I can't do more easily with my credit card.' That's false as your credit card issuer controls who you can and cannot transact with. With BTC you control whom you transact with.

In other words: Bitcoin is mostly good for illegal transactions.

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#202

Post by rifung »

asenna wrote: post #168

What's with all the extreme negativity with Bitcoin and its trading price on HN? I've been noticing that in all the BTC related threads recently. Yes, this is possibly getting too large too fast. Yes there is a chance this is a bubble because the barbers and shoeshine boys are talking about it. But there is also a chance that we genuinely are at the beginning of the transition from Fiat currencies to crypto (beginnin…

> But there is also a chance that we genuinely are at the beginning of the transition from Fiat currencies to crypto (beginning of the S-curve mass adoption)

I can only speak for myself but I see this chance as practically being 0.

As far as I can tell the only people who would need something like Bitcoin are those who participate in illegal/immoral activity. Seeing as there is no regulation, I don't think it's far fetched to believe those who have a large amount of Bitcoin, such as hackers who were paid ransoms in it, would have motivation to try to increase the perceived value of it.

Personally I believe that people, especially those who already participate in illegal activity, trying to profit is easy for my mind to grasp and believe than for some technological revolution. I suppose the bias from my personal experiences shows as well given that I haven't met a single person who has purchased Bitcoin for its utility but many who have bought it because "it's going to go UP!!!!!!!!!".

I suppose personally I don't want to see people throw their money away, especially because in this case I believe it will benefit scammers, and that's why I have a negative attitude towards it.

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#203

Post by jjeaff »

asenna wrote: post #168

What's with all the extreme negativity with Bitcoin and its trading price on HN? I've been noticing that in all the BTC related threads recently. Yes, this is possibly getting too large too fast. Yes there is a chance this is a bubble because the barbers and shoeshine boys are talking about it. But there is also a chance that we genuinely are at the beginning of the transition from Fiat currencies to crypto (beginnin…

>But there is also a chance that we genuinely are at the beginning of the transition from Fiat currencies to crypto

Maybe, but the current price is no reflection of that. The current price is based on speculation, not utility. No "maybe" about it.

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#204

Post by tim333 »

sedtrader wrote: post #6

Going to need some rules and regulations. Last thing we need are big banks overleveraging on crypto currencies for the excess return. When, not if, this bubble bursts hopefully it doesn't take the whole economy down with it. The whole financial market wants exposure to crypto at this point.

I'm not sure any banks have crypto on their balance sheets so you may be a bit ahead of things there.

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#205

Post by pcarolan »

asenna wrote: post #168

What's with all the extreme negativity with Bitcoin and its trading price on HN? I've been noticing that in all the BTC related threads recently. Yes, this is possibly getting too large too fast. Yes there is a chance this is a bubble because the barbers and shoeshine boys are talking about it. But there is also a chance that we genuinely are at the beginning of the transition from Fiat currencies to crypto (beginnin…

Some of us think that burning coal at 250kwh[1] per transaction isn't sustainable.

[1]https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/12/bitcoins-insane-...

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#206

Post by Nydhal »

forgotpassagan wrote: post #190
pzxc wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The lightning network could fix everything, or fail spectacularly. I think an even bigger danger than failing spectacularly is if they take too long to roll it out. Other cryptocurrencies are already gaining some favor because of the situation BTC is in now with the high transaction fees. It has a good chance of working, in my opinion (the lightning network), if they don't dawdle too long. But the clock is ticking.

IMO Lightning network solves a non-problem. It only sets up a transactionless channel between two parties. The whole promise of Bitcoin was secure transfer to anyone. Maintaining a balance between two parties is trivial and solved thousands of years ago. The whole reason we have currency is to allow transactions between people that don't trust each other, so I don't think Lightning network will do anything significan…

Most transactions fall into the first -solved- category, a minority is in the second.

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#207

Post by forgotpassagan »

jjeaff wrote: post #201
jakupovic wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'I can't do anything with Bitcoin that I can't do more easily with my credit card.' That's false as your credit card issuer controls who you can and cannot transact with. With BTC you control whom you transact with.

In other words: Bitcoin is mostly good for illegal transactions.

I wasn't going to say it... But somebody did

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#208

Post by geetfun »

olalonde wrote: post #199
asenna wrote: post #168

What's with all the extreme negativity with Bitcoin and its trading price on HN? I've been noticing that in all the BTC related threads recently. Yes, this is possibly getting too large too fast. Yes there is a chance this is a bubble because the barbers and shoeshine boys are talking about it. But there is also a chance that we genuinely are at the beginning of the transition from Fiat currencies to crypto (beginnin…

A lot of the negativity comes from people who missed the boat, sold too early, etc. Also, people who don't understand bitcoin or confuse it with ICOs/blockchain crap. I'd say that's the bulk of it to be honest.

I agree. I "missed out" on purchasing some bitcoin assets early on. So seeing a lot of the rise right now, I don't share in the excitement as -- I would imagine -- someone who's holding a few thousand BTCs.

Having said that, I think there's a bit of (healthy) skepticism amongst those of us who hold "traditional" assets regarding BTC.

As someone who holds real estate as part of the investment portfolio, I understand and see the return from the rental properties. Stocks give me dividends. Bonds give me interest payments.

Currently, all these yields are in dollars. But would I gladly accept BTC as payment? Currently -- no. It's too volatile for it to be useful. And the entire issue of blockchain transaction backlog is worrisome.

So if a tenant comes to me and says, "I'll pay this month's rent in BTC," I'd still have to say, "No thanks. I'll take dollars please."

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#209

Post by akira2501 »

theoh wrote: post #195
asenna wrote: post #168

What's with all the extreme negativity with Bitcoin and its trading price on HN? I've been noticing that in all the BTC related threads recently. Yes, this is possibly getting too large too fast. Yes there is a chance this is a bubble because the barbers and shoeshine boys are talking about it. But there is also a chance that we genuinely are at the beginning of the transition from Fiat currencies to crypto (beginnin…

Blockchain-based currencies are not an acceptable replacement for the existing monetary system because of the extreme brittleness of their mechanisms. You really are completely on your own when it comes to things like getting hacked, losing your wallet, etc. And we know that nobody's machine is secure against a persistent attacker. The social mechanisms (regulatory etc.) around retail banking are a crucial safety mea…

> because of the extreme brittleness of their mechanisms.

On top of all that, we're still entirely unsure how the system is going to function once all bitcoin has been mined and it becomes a pure transaction system.

Re: Goldman Sachs Is Setting Up a Cryptocurrency Trading Desk

#210

Post by alehul »

jjeaff wrote: post #201
jakupovic wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'I can't do anything with Bitcoin that I can't do more easily with my credit card.' That's false as your credit card issuer controls who you can and cannot transact with. With BTC you control whom you transact with.

In other words: Bitcoin is mostly good for illegal transactions.

Primarily, with another use being those who lack a proper banking system.
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