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Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

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Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#21
post #10
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Every $1 spent on buying and maintaining useless cameras is $1 not spent on actual policing. So, much better than nothing?

If you dream of a Utopian land without police officers, I hear Somalia is gorgeous this time of year.

Per https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependen..., Somalia has roughly the same number of police officers per capita as Canada, Denmark, Sweden, and South Korea.

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#22
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This summer, an officer in Maryland accidentally taped himself planting drugs. This case alone justifies the continued use of cameras (especially without the on/off button). Cameras should be under direct control of the judiciary, available to defense and not merely the district attorney's office. http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/bs-md-ci-bod...

Allowing the police to have total control and oversight was, to me, the point where I knew the police body camera idea wasn't going to fix everything right away. It feels like mostly lip service but it has shown some good splotches here and there. LIke you said, until they are out of the hands of police they are basically useless... Unless buffoon cops forget to turn it on / off depending on the situation.

I would say if an officer has their camera off in line of duty, and something happens they should be charged with obstruction of justice.

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#23
IMHO it seems that the body cameras are quite frequently "malfunctioning" when they would be needed.

edit: some links from quick google search.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/07/19/us/minneapolis-police-shoo...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/a-cop-fir...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/after-baton-rouge-shoot...

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and publish footage in a way that cannot be censored Easier said than done. Police officers are often seeing people on the worst day of their life. It would be an incredible decrease in privacy and general dignity if all footage was just published uncensored. If someone assaulted you and stole your cloths would you want a video online of you being interviewed about the experience with just a towel on (and probably…

In principle, it ought to be possible to ensure an encrypted version of all the video is always uploaded to some governmental servers that the police can not tamper with, where the video can only be accessed under appropriate circumstances by an appropriate authority.

You're abstracting a lot of your argument away. When are "appropriate circumstances?" Who is an "appropriate authority?" Surely not the police department? Or the DA? Those questions are the crux of the issue, not the medium on which the recordings are stored.

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#25
Another data point:

"The presence of body-worn cameras caused police to refrain from the use of force even when its was necessary for self-protection."

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11292-017-9311-5

Tl;dr here: https://twitter.com/DegenRolf/status/942692766177480704

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#26
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Allowing the police to have total control and oversight was, to me, the point where I knew the police body camera idea wasn't going to fix everything right away. It feels like mostly lip service but it has shown some good splotches here and there. LIke you said, until they are out of the hands of police they are basically useless... Unless buffoon cops forget to turn it on / off depending on the situation.

I would say if an officer has their camera off in line of duty, and something happens they should be charged with obstruction of justice.

If I was interviewing you and I told you that if your laptop stopped working during office hours you could be brought up on criminal charges that could include jail time - would you take the job?

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In principle, it ought to be possible to ensure an encrypted version of all the video is always uploaded to some governmental servers that the police can not tamper with, where the video can only be accessed under appropriate circumstances by an appropriate authority.

You're abstracting a lot of your argument away. When are "appropriate circumstances?" Who is an "appropriate authority?" Surely not the police department? Or the DA? Those questions are the crux of the issue, not the medium on which the recordings are stored.

An appropriate authority is a judge, and appropriate circumstances are if and when it passes the requirements to be shown in court or accessed with a warrant.

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In principle, it ought to be possible to ensure an encrypted version of all the video is always uploaded to some governmental servers that the police can not tamper with, where the video can only be accessed under appropriate circumstances by an appropriate authority.

You're abstracting a lot of your argument away. When are "appropriate circumstances?" Who is an "appropriate authority?" Surely not the police department? Or the DA? Those questions are the crux of the issue, not the medium on which the recordings are stored.

You can create a system with authorization, ACL and an audit trail with justifications. It is less complicated to implement and can be audited after the fact.

When you need access to an information, the system ask a reason (a procedure number or something) the system can grant it or not and all is logged. You can have a third party or authority notified and they could grant access to more sensible information.

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#29
post #23

IMHO it seems that the body cameras are quite frequently "malfunctioning" when they would be needed. edit: some links from quick google search. http://edition.cnn.com/2017/07/19/us/minneapolis-police-shoo... https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/a-cop-fir... https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/after-baton-rouge-shoot...

It's quite possible they are functioning just as often when not needed, and that this only seems malicious because of selection bias.

Re: Study finds police body cameras had no significant impact on use of force

#30
This article is a poster child for jumping to conclusions. It's just as possible that there's no impact because there aren't a significant number of violent actions performed by police with the mindset that it is not justified.

We seem to have a great understanding of the detachment with which a doctor needs to operate to handle a stressful and high stakes daily environment, but somehow totally lack this empathy when it comes to police.

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