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Firefox 57 delays requests to tracking domains

janbambas.cz

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Re: Firefox 57 delays requests to tracking domains

#261

Post by bzbarsky »

sundarurfriend wrote: post #218

> To conclude on how useful the tailing feature is – unfortunately, at the moment I don’t have enough data to provide (it’s on its way, though.) I wonder if this post was rushed to publication, to manage Mozilla's public image and reestablish it as a friend to user privacy, after the 'Looking Glass' fiasco a few days ago. (I'm not exactly opposed to such PR efforts, as long as they're accompanied by actual internal c…

This post is on the personal blog of an engineer. I somewhat doubt it was posted in response to the Looking Glass thing.

Re: Firefox 57 delays requests to tracking domains

#262

Post by Vinnl »

privacywall wrote: post #239
Vinnl wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fun fact: you can turn off telemetry yourself in Firefox. And it's open source, so you (or someone else) can check that it's actually off.

For the sake of Firefox users, I hope you are right. There's been complaints it flips back on after Firefox updates, so your privacy is at the whims of Firefox. Fun fact: Firefox just pushed out the Looking Glass add-on to users without notice or consent this past weekend.

In the case of it flipping back on, you're at the whims of bugs - just like with all software. If there's any organisation I'd trust, it's Mozilla - if only because if they make mistakes, there is a lot of pressure for them to correct this (case in point: Looking Glass).

Note that Mozilla pushes code without explicit consent for all parts of it all the time - they're called software updates. The problem in this case was that it was for a potential feature that very few people cared for, and that it showed up as a scary extension in the extension list. That definitely should not have happened, but it's not a privacy violation.

Re: Firefox 57 delays requests to tracking domains

#263

Post by legohead »

bzbarsky wrote: post #136
legohead wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the web standard about delaying scripts deliberately encoded into the page? Why downvote and no explanation? I want to know if I missed something.

Per the standards, scheduling and prioritization of downloads is up to browsers. The standard also defines that scripts that are not async have to be executed before later content can be parsed (because they can document.write()). They can still be loaded with any priority the browser wants; they just need to block observable DOM construction.

Thank you.

Re: Firefox 57 delays requests to tracking domains

#264

Post by Sylos »

bigbugbag wrote: post #222
jonchang wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's basically a content blocker like Adblock or noscript.

I'm convinced it's not. noscript is blocking scripts and xss and does all kinds of things, while mozilla intently removed the option to disable scripts in firefox. I do not know about adblock as I stopped using it a long time ago and now use ublock origin a general purpose blocker, but I certainly remember how mozilla was vocal about never adding a blocker in firefox as this would be contrary to (actually their busin…

Well, yeah, "Tracking Protection", as it's called, is far from what NoScript does (which does a boatload more than just blocking JavaScript). But it is quite a lot like AdBlock Plus or uBlock Origin, except not focused on blocking ads and rather focused on blocking tracking scripts (but with how many ads contain tracking scripts, it is pretty much an ad blocker, too). If you know the extension Disconnect, Mozilla uses the blocking list from that.

Tracking Protection is default-enabled in Private Browsing, can be manually enabled in normal browsing.

The "BS PR" reason for them not necessarily wanting to block trackers/ads, is that webpage owners want to make money. If they don't have a way of making money off of Firefox, then they likely won't bother testing, fixing or even optimizing their webpage for Firefox. It would make it a lot more likely for webpages to be broken in Firefox.

Default-enabling Tracking Protection in Private Browsing already caused a huge outcry and by now there seems to have developed an entire new business around privacy-respecting porn ads, so that's always nice.

Re: Firefox 57 delays requests to tracking domains

#265

Post by Sylos »

659087 wrote: post #115

Tracking scripts should be blocked by default, not just delayed. If a user has some strange desire to be watched, give them the option to opt-in to their browser unblocking tracking scripts/domains.

Without tracking scripts, many webpage owners will be making much less money off of Firefox. If they don't make a whole lot of money off of Firefox, they won't test and optimize for Firefox much. So, we'd be seeing a lot more breakage of webpages in Firefox.

Mozilla could maybe afford to pull something like that, if they had the majority marketshare, as then webpage owners would have to deal with their decisions in order to still make any revenue at all, but well, they don't.

Re: Firefox 57 delays requests to tracking domains

#266

Post by jamesfe »

codezero wrote: post #68

I work for an analytics company, this will affect my snippet – I don't think it is a big deal, but I'm going to benchmark it on a few sites. From what is described here, it may actually help us. When folks throw tons of tags into their site, we're all competing against each-other as well as the site's own loading – it makes sense to prioritize the site's rendering. I think of this as no more invasive than pre-caching…

I'm not sure why you feel the need to defend yourself. HN has a low opinion of the concept of selling user data, but in practice, there are plenty of ad-supported startups represented here.

Google is selling your data to marketers. Facebook is one giant data-collection/data-sales empire. In theory, the HN collective hates data selling, but in practice, they love the companies that are doing it and their products.

I find it ironic that I come here and see people worshipping the big adtech companies and their tech but then when someone posts a comment about not selling user data, a thousand tin-hat naysayers jump out of the woodwork to flog them to death.

It's OK. It's why I can read the NY Times and a thousand other online newspapers - FOR FREE. It's why I can go to Google and type in "why does my butt burn when I poop" and get an answer - FOR FREE. It's why I can use dozens of adtech and user-data-supported services - FOR FREE. I pay for those things with data about me, my habits, and my browsing history.

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