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US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

nytimes.com

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Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#81

Post by crimsonalucard »

makmanalp wrote: post #73
crimsonalucard wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ebola is one such virus. In terms of evolution these viruses tend to burn out by killing the host. Evolutionary pressures push viruses towards symbiotic equilibrium. Thus in the worst case scenario there will be survivors who are immune or the virus or the virus will burn out until the only strain left does not harm humans. The later was the case with ebola.

It sure killed a LOT of people in the process though, so I wouldn't say that that's quite so reassuring.

Yeah, but we're definitely safe from an extinction level event.

Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#83

Post by wickawic »

jacquesm wrote: post #76
crimsonalucard wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ebola is one such virus. In terms of evolution these viruses tend to burn out by killing the host. Evolutionary pressures push viruses towards symbiotic equilibrium. Thus in the worst case scenario there will be survivors who are immune or the virus or the virus will burn out until the only strain left does not harm humans. The later was the case with ebola.

If anything Ebola is too lethal. It tends to burn out locally before it can spread far from its originating point though if someone should immediately travel after becoming infected it could spread to a new location. But in the majority of the cases so far it has burned out before it could spread to a new village, though the largest outbreak to date claimed in excess of 10,000 lives and spread quite far. http://www.b…

You can just move to Madagascar and close the ports.

Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#84

Post by AnkhMorporkian »

ethbro wrote: post #68
AnkhMorporkian wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't heard anything about continued leaking. Any sources on that? Googling turns up nothing besides the sheep incident.

Not sure I want to Google "where is US military nerve gas stockpiled?"

I did google it, there was nothing of import, and that's why I asked the question.

Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#85

Post by top_post »

So to bring a technology angle to this, there isn't anything remotely equivalent around this for Cybersecurity where it has some parallels. Everyone understands how bad a pandemic is - the risk of lives is obviously more important than data - however with the reliance of technology lives can be indirectly affected, such as the case of WannaCry shutting down hospitals and associated healthcare technology.

Vulnerabilities researched and weaponized by the government, ended up in the public, and caused global damage. There is no oversight into how these are produced or their risks.

Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#86

Post by emodendroket »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #78
emodendroket wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you "cannot trust regulators or legislators at the federal level" how can you trust the laws? Who writes them, and who enforces them, if not legislators and regulators, respectively?

Legislators tend to not write the laws anymore. They just take the copy the lobby groups have prepared in advance and submit it as a bill. Congressmen don't even bother to read the laws they vote for.

They do not literally write the laws in most cases but I don't see how that affects the argument.

Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#87

Post by matt4077 »

yegle wrote: post #4

The intention seems legit, despite the concern. Quote from the article: The pathogen to be modified must pose a serious health threat, and the work must produce knowledge — such as a vaccine — that would benefit humans. Finally, there must be no safer way to do the research.

I have no serious concerns with the US' good intentions, nor their ability to properly manage such a program.

What I fear, however, is that this action undermines the Biological Weapons Convention[0].

The convention explicitly allows for research such as this, yes. Nonetheless, it effectively worked as a moratorium on such research, with the US leading by example.

This program creates a situation much like nuclear research, where civil and military use cases exist on a continuum, with the first often being used to cover the second. Note how biological agents, where the US had the moral high ground, have entirely disappeared. Meanwhile, nuclear and chemical agents, which can be produced under the cover of closely related civil industries, are still very much threatening (and killing) people today.

[0]:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_Weapons_Convention

Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#88

Post by craftyguy »

crimsonalucard wrote: post #64
chrisper wrote: post #60

You know how when you watch movies and because you know so much about tech you can tell that most of the stuff done in movies regarding hacking etc is bullshit and not real. Now I have a lack in knowledge of biology at this level, but can someone maybe explain to me how all those disease mass extinction movies cannot be real? I feel like my lack of knowledge here causes my concerns when reading stuff like this articl…

Ebola is one such virus. In terms of evolution these viruses tend to burn out by killing the host. Evolutionary pressures push viruses towards symbiotic equilibrium. Thus in the worst case scenario there will be survivors who are immune or the virus or the virus will burn out until the only strain left does not harm humans. The later was the case with ebola.

> In terms of evolution these viruses tend to burn out by killing the host.

I learned two things playing that 'Pandemic' flash game a few years back:

1) don't evolve deadly characteristics until you've infected as many people as possible (to get around ebola's issue you pointed out)

2) Madagascar is the place to be in the event of a global epidemic

Re: US Federal Ban on Making Lethal Viruses Is Lifted

#89

Post by matt4077 »

chrisper wrote: post #60

You know how when you watch movies and because you know so much about tech you can tell that most of the stuff done in movies regarding hacking etc is bullshit and not real. Now I have a lack in knowledge of biology at this level, but can someone maybe explain to me how all those disease mass extinction movies cannot be real? I feel like my lack of knowledge here causes my concerns when reading stuff like this articl…

One aspect such movies almost always get wrong is ease of protection: With only modest countermeasures (face coverings, washing hands, ventilating rooms etc), you can drastically cut down the rate of transmission. A scientist with advanced equipment and knowledge getting infected is extremely unlikely. In the real world it happens, but only to 0.x%, and only to hospital staff spending weeks with thousands of infected people, under often sub-optimal conditions.

It's completely possible to go years without catching a cold if you're willing to devote maybe 10% of your time and a little money to it, and avoid certain situation. We just don't bother because getting a cold isn't (usually) that terrible.

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