I really don't get these Yahoo is dead stories. It's still the biggest site in the world if all it's properties are put together.
http://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&chdd=1&chds=1&... Saying "Yahoo is dead" (pg didn't, btw) is a sensationalist way of saying "Yahoo is in a slow, steady decline." To predict this, look at the leading indicators: - new products - strategic acquisitions - flow of talent - company morale - growth relative to competition - positions in key emerging markets Yahoo seems to be struggling in all these areas. Also, using…
What Happened to Yahoo
131–140 of 282 posts
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#132Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#133Earlier quoted context omitted.
Apple isn't a software company per se--they have a lot of EE's, other engineers, industrial designers, and so forth. These people have different cultures from hackers, by and large. But by and large they seem to demand the most from everyone they hire, including programmers. They don't have the compulsion to fill up on staff as much as they want to have the best people. It's impossible to tell without working there (…
But for all that, I don't think Apple's ever found themselves with the reputation of the type of single-minded overarching elitist snobbery as the backbone of the hiring process in the same way Google has. "...but they didn't have the kind of single-minded, almost obnoxiously elitist focus on hiring..." Apple seems to want to hire the best, but the best being based on actual capability instead of the school you went…
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#134[edit: this thread has some insightful replies by others that are worth reading.] I'm sorry, this may be PG's backyard, but I've gotta call bullshit. Note: I am not a Yahoo employee or corporate shill. 1. "At Yahoo this death spiral started early." Apparently this death spiral took TWELVE YEARS (the WWW is 20 years old), and Yahoo is still #1 (or #2) in terms of total properties on the web. How is this a death spiral…
Re: Speaking of talent: Yahoo got best paper at EVERY data-related conference in 2010. No single lab(Google,MS) or university(Stanford etc) has ever done this. Clearly you can achieve this without talent, pg! engineers/hackers don't usually focus on doing academic research and writing academic papers targeted to top-tier academic conferences. Yahoo Research is certainly a leader in the academic world, but that might…
I am in total agreement with this. These days anything targeted towards top-tier conferences typically has a sales-marketing slant wrapped around it.
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#135Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, it's not. That gets at the very essence of my original comment. One of the assertions in the article is that a hacker culture is a necessary ingredient for a successful technology company. I see Apple as a counterexample to this argument. And it's a counterexample that shouldn't be ignored. Apple is driven by design (industrial design, product design, graphic design). They think about products, not technology. Th…
I don't think what pg means by "hackerly culture" is any different from what you said. It sounds like Apple is doing exactly what pg tells hackers to do: make something people want. "Hackerly culture" to me implies that you have people ("hackers") who are able to explore the space of possibilities and invent new things rather than just building them to some businessman's specification. It's not essential that you ven…
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#136Earlier quoted context omitted.
Privacy, perhaps.
Privacy and social networking are naturally opposing ideas--social networking is all about sharing information with people and privacy is all about keeping information from people. That's like saying Google ("organize the world's information") overlooked the importance of disorganization or ignorance. It won't be privacy at all that Facebook overlooks, it'll be something completely orthogonal to that axis. It is, how…
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#137It was a great idea, original and effective, though I'm not how to feel about their patenting it. If they hadn't, they would have been copied and crushed without credit. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goto.com#Origins_of_Goto.com
As it was, they got 2.7 million shares from Google's infringement, and later acquired by Yahoo for $1.63 billion.
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#138Disclaimer #2: This is my own completely unsanctioned opinion and does not necessarily represent Yahoo!'s views or opinions.
I'm obviously biased here, but I have a great respect for HN and PG so I wanted to talk about this.
PG accuses Yahoo! of two things right at the very top of the article and the rest of the article is more details on those things. They are a) access to easy money removed Yahoo!'s desire to find the next big thing b) ambivalence about being a technology company.
I'm not going to substantially repute a) because I think it is true. However, I think it's a pretty big ask to expect someone being successful to see past the current success to the next big win. PG admit's neither he nor Larry and Sergey really understood how big search was. As such I feel it's a slightly ad-homonym attack to blame Yahoo! for not being Google. We didn't win the big prize, but we also aren't AOL, Lycos or Ask.com either. Just because we didn't become Google doesn't mean Yahoo! has failed.
As an engineer though PG's second point strikes me as deeply unfair. I joined Yahoo! in 2004 in the UK. The team I joined was exceptional. For a team of 30 people there were about 15 book authored by the team. I personally had written W3C standards and multi Web Standards Project founders littered the team. The rest of the team were coders, much better than I.
Now I work in US for the developer network and I get to see the vast range of technologies that Yahoo! does from Y! Research through to the engineering teams. There is a reason 'Hack Days' started here, because the engineers here are passionate about those technologies and playing with them.
I'm also on the Yahoo! Open Source Working Group and I see all the open source we put out of the door. We should probably do a better job of telling people how much, but it's a lot more than you think. I find it troubling that PG who left the company 10 years ago, can now, accuse me and my colleagues of apathy about technology when it's so fundamental to what Yahoo! does.
I think what PG is really talking to is two things. Firstly, it's important for a company to have a 'core competency'. Describing ourselves as a media company makes it clear to our investors and our employees the field of play. Secondly, the ease at which a cash-cow, such as Google's search war chest, allows them to make their presence felt in the technology community reminds people about all the things they touch. I am both proud an envious that Google have the freedom to do that, but again, it doesn't mean Yahoo! failed because we don't.
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#139Somebody please help poor pg and design him some prettier buttons than those purple beveled monstrosities..
Re: What Happened to Yahoo
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
If most (all) of your early employees are hackers, how does it not make sense to hire a hacker to manage HR?
If you start a gardening service does it make sense to hire a gardener to do your finances? Not to be offensive, but I think a little bit of respect for other lines of work would be a good thing here.