iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages • Hacker News Board

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#201

Post by Fnoord » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 9:13 AM UTC

ballenf wrote: post #154

ohyes wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The solution is a battery you can replace, like every phone used to have. There aren’t only two solutions to this problem. (Technically you can still replace the iPhone battery, unfortunately it isn’t trivial like in the bad old days when phones didn’t have high def touch screens.)

iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY. It's like $80 w/o warranty or AppleCare. I've bought dozens of Android replacement batteries and the only batteries worth the cost of shipping were actual real OEM ones. And those always cost >$60. Knockoffs would start out decent and then die within a few weeks to months. Apple's approach gets my vote. You get the upside of built-in battery and the peace of mind w…

> iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY. It's like $80 w/o warranty or AppleCare.

The easiness of replacing the battery has gone up with iPhone 7/8/X compared to iPhone 6. You can verify this on iFixit guides. The iPhone 6 is _relatively_ easy to replace because you don't need say a heatgun. You do need some special screwdrivers which you gotta buy. You can, on iFixit. I just bought a whole kit (on sale during Black Friday).

> I've bought dozens of Android replacement batteries and the only batteries worth the cost of shipping were actual real OEM ones. And those always cost >$60.

20 EUR for mine: https://shop.fairphone.com/en/spare-parts/fairphone-2-batter...

Replacing any parts on my phone is very easy. Only thing is that the main module with CPU board etc is ~300 EUR.

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#202

Post by Fnoord » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 9:17 AM UTC

rileymat2 wrote: post #161

Whitestrake wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other than: 1. Allow performance to degrade 2. Allow longevity to degrade 3. Allow the battery to be replaced 4. Some revolutionary battery technology that doesn't degrade?? What solutions are you thinking of?

Let the user toggle between 1 and 2? Which could be useful for new phones where, even though currently full, you know you won’t be able to charge next.

> Let the user toggle between 1 and 2?

Wrong company, pal. Apple historically decides for the user. Heck, they still do it with their App Store. Often that may go right, but not always.

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#203

Post by alkonaut » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 9:18 AM UTC

yoodenvranx wrote: post #193

alkonaut wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the battery capcity could be increased to the point where I didn't need to worry about charging it every day (night), like an old feature phone, then I would see the point. Otherwise I'm agreeing with apple - let's make the hardware faster and the screen brighter instead and just make sure the battery lasts a whole day. Having e.g. 50% more battery wouldn't do anything for me. It would save me that one day per yea…

> and just make sure the battery lasts a whole day. But the problem is that the iPhones seems to last a day only when they are new-ish and there is no safety buffer down the road. If it is fine on release day it will not be fine after 2 years if there additional capacity build in.

Yes, that's a perfectly valid point - if they made it last 150% of a day on release they could ensure it lasts 100% of a day after two years without having to throttle the hardware.

I'm all for that - I do want all the power of the hardware and a full days charge, for the whole lifetime of the phone.

Unfortunately it's very much in the sellers interest to not do this. If they make it last 100% of a dayt on release they can instead make it cheaper/lighter/more powerful, AND if they throttle or make it behave worse some other way after 2 years, they also make it obsolete at just the right point in time.

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#204

Post by Fnoord » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 9:27 AM UTC

chocolatebunny wrote: post #64

codeulike wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds a bit like Fairphone (well, not the ugly part) https://www.fairphone.com/en/

It's cool that they have two SIM slots and an SD slot. I wish more phones had that. But the removable battery doesn't seem to be particularly large.

Its not, and its a smartphone from 2015 with a SD800 with 2 GB RAM. There's a lot of pros and cons about it, but at least you can repair the components yourself. Just the other day I installed a new camera module, all on my own. I also replaced the battery. For a mere 20 EUR. (The camera module was front + back for 75 EUR.)

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#205

Post by ohyes » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 9:37 AM UTC

Whitestrake wrote: post #145

asimpletune wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are definitely still solutions.

Other than: 1. Allow performance to degrade 2. Allow longevity to degrade 3. Allow the battery to be replaced 4. Some revolutionary battery technology that doesn't degrade?? What solutions are you thinking of?

Well, they've actually done kinetic charging smartphones, but it had a battery and i believe it was extremely expensive.

So if you did that and instead of a battery combined it with a (relatively large) capacitor (or some sort of amazing spring) you could have the iPhone equivalent of a shake and shine flashlight. (One bonus being that there would be absolutely no holes, as it would not be possible to charge it via a wall outlet).

It would be completely impractical, but there wouldn't be a battery, so the battery wouldn't degrade. The alternative storage mechanism might degrade, and who knows what all of the shaking would do to the delicate electronics, likely nothing good.

Anyway, I think it'll catch on. I look forward to watching young people on the train shake their iPhone vigorously before making a silly face and taking a picture of themselves in 10 years time.

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#206

Post by mschuster91 » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 9:40 AM UTC

ohyes wrote: post #96

Someone1234 wrote: post #6

I feel like more transparency would have been welcomed, but aside from that this is a "no win" situation, since you have to pick a winner: - Do you degrade performance but leave screen-on time relatively unchanged? - Do you degrade screen-on time but leave performance relatively unchanged? Most Android devices seem to do the opposite (lose screen-on time, but keep performance relatively unchanged). Different people w…

The solution is a battery you can replace, like every phone used to have. There aren’t only two solutions to this problem. (Technically you can still replace the iPhone battery, unfortunately it isn’t trivial like in the bad old days when phones didn’t have high def touch screens.)

> unfortunately it isn’t trivial

With a good heat gun and toolkit, it's doable in anything from 15-30 min (more if the case is bent or damaged from falls).

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#207

Post by terminalcommand » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 10:00 AM UTC

nbanks wrote: post #163

ohyes wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The solution is a battery you can replace, like every phone used to have. There aren’t only two solutions to this problem. (Technically you can still replace the iPhone battery, unfortunately it isn’t trivial like in the bad old days when phones didn’t have high def touch screens.)

I replace my iPhone battery with a cheap one off eBay every year or two when something else breaks. Battery life is pretty good, but the screen pops up now making the phone 0.5mm thicker. It's doing OK for a 5 year old phone, but my friends can't believe I paid $800 for an iPhone 5.

If the screen is popping up, that condition might be trigerred by a swollen battery.

My iPhone 5 also did that, after a while, it worsened so much that the screen colors became affected. I took it to an apple store, paid the fee and had them replace the battery.

IMHO a swollen battery is a huge risk, and apple should have replaced my phone without charge.

Anyways, be careful and if the battery is swollen, it's time for yet another battery change :)

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#208

Post by romanovcode » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 10:03 AM UTC

jdking wrote: post #199

Why does this correlate so well with iOS version increments? My iPhone 6 was faultless prior to the upgrade to iOS 11, and immediately after it battery life was greatly reduced and it now shuts down automatically when the battery hits 10%. Apparently I am now supposed to accept that the battery has degraded not gradually but all at once and on the same day as I upgraded iOS, and this is now being managed for my benef…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#209

Post by terminalcommand » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 10:13 AM UTC

yoodenvranx wrote: post #50

pbreit wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about a bigger battery? My primary criterion with each iPhone purchase is which has longest battery life.

Apple has decided that people want to buy razorthin phones and there is just not way to fit a large battery in there. I wish there were phones built like the old IBM thinkpads. Bulky, square, ugly but also indestructible and fully user servicable with replaceable batteries.

Contrary to popular opinion Thinkpads are not durable as they seem. There are various conditions such as deep coma (when the laptop won't wake from a sleep) or random shutdowns unrelated to heat/any observable cause etc.

I thought my thinkpad x201 was like a tank, but then random shutdowns became more frequent. I disassambled the laptop 4-5 times, replaced thermal paste, checked connections, replaced all software (including BIOS), couldn't find a solution. Then I stumbled upon a 45 page thread at the lenovo support forum. Many people were claiming the existence of the exact problem, but the only solution was to "replace the motherboard".

At least, apple offers world-wide decent for their products. With used thinkpads, you're basically on your own, no matter how tech-savvy you are.

If I were to purchase another laptop for on-the-go usage I will think twice before opting out for a thinkpad for it's durability.

Thinkpads are marvelous machines, but in my experience not all that glitters is gold :).

Re: iPhone Performance Degrades as Battery Ages

#210

Post by gnyman » Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 10:16 AM UTC

xmpirate wrote: post #191

saagarjha wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might be something wrong with your SMC or thermal throttling going on. Either way I'd suggest resetting the SMC and if that doesn't fix it check out Activity Monitor to see what's wrong.

Nothing really. I did reset the SMC couple of times and also check the Activity Monitor every time the fan speed increases, but to no avail.

Did you try running the hardware test? https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201257

I had a old Air which ran very slowly and fans spinning like crazy due to a issue with the cable from the keyboard/touchpad. Apparently if the SMC does not get proper signals it will go into a "failsafe" where things work but slowly.

Probably not the same issue, but just a little anecdote on a similar symptoms caused by different issues so that nobody gets tunnel vision on the battery, which might very well be the cause in this case.