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Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

nytimes.com

201–209 of 209 posts

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#201
A lot of the arguments for getting away from tips are for servers.

There's already a solution in place to handle cashless tips for them. They aren't responsible for the transaction fee a lot of processors pass onto the gig economy. It works relatively well, even in the event of loss of internet or power.

The laws of averages work out for an average server, I worked for 5 years in the restaurant industry and two years of that was 100% waiting tables. I averaged $24-$26K between those two years in two different states and 4 different cities. Both of those states are at the US minimum wage of $2.13/hr (for restaurant waiters).

I worked about 30-40 hours a week. We're talking ~$12-$13/hr average. It's was definitely much better than any minimum wage position I could have had.

Anecdotally, the servers I knew who complained most about the wage were also the least responsible ones with their money. We worked at a restaurant that gave you your tips at the end of the night and to many peers, the urge to spend that cold hard cash was too strong. Those responsible but just underpaid were underpaid either way; they still could usually keep it together at $12-$13/hr, still a good wage for someone relatively just getting started career-wise.

Whatever wage you made from the $2.13/hr usually just covered your taxes. Most of my deposited paychecks were less than $10 every other week.

I know that this isn't what other countries do, but it does work and keeps most families and individuals out of the poverty level. The requirements for work are relatively undemanding and most people who want a job serving get a job serving.

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In most of these industries, the "fair wage" is actually less than tips. Or at least they used to be. Ending tipping will hurt them overall. Just think about how a great a deal tips are for waiters. 10-20% of gross revenue is huge.

You greatly overestimate the amount waiters make.

I think you greatly underestimate how little unskilled workers generally make.

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#203
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that would cost the companies more and they're happy to get away with paying less. It's really not a mystery.

I wish there was a list of Bay Area restaurants that don't require tipping. I discovered one last Friday and look forward to returning for the good food, service, and fair wages.

Lanesplitter pizza claims to pay a livable wage

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I had a few thousand dollars in unpaid overtime withheld by an employer; the Department of Labor helped me file a complaint, assigned me a representative, ignored all of my phone calls, and I never heard from them again. I tried to get a labor lawyer to intervene but the total losses weren't enough for them to bother litigating. They sent a demand letter and it was ignored. Next option would have been small cla…

I'm sorry to hear about your experience, but I don't think that it represents the nation at large. Here is why... According to the most recent census data I could find (2015), there are approx. 27M businesses in the US[1]. Assuming half those businesses are wage thieves, that would mean 13.5M businesses are currently in violation of the the law. The DOL can place a $10k sanction on the business owner for a first infr…

Instead of just making guesses about what the hypothetical payoff would be for a business, why not look at actual data?

A report from the Economic Policy Institute[1] found that minimum wage violations affected 17% of workers in the states surveyed (the ten most populous in the US) and averaged $3,300 per worker who was affected.

[1] http://www.epi.org/publication/employers-steal-billions-from...

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The restaurant should pay more than minimum wage. Perhaps, but it sounds more like that your minimum wage isn't set to be a living wage[1]. That's the important part - minimum wages should be set so that someone who is working full time (~40 hours/week) should be getting enough income so that they can afford a modest standard of living for themselves and a family too. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_wage

> minimum wages should be set so that someone who is working full time (~40 hours/week) should be getting enough income so that they can afford a modest standard of living for themselves and a family too Can I ask... Why? Shouldn't a "minimum" wage provide a "minimal" lifestyle rather than a modest lifestyle? And why should one be able to support a family on a single minimum wage?

Because single mothers exist, so supporting a family on one income is needed to ensure a minimal amount of suffering happens to children who didn't ask to be poor, and have no way of opting out of poverty.

Also, modest = minimal by the original standards.

Historical context: https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/minimum_wage

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> minimum wages should be set so that someone who is working full time (~40 hours/week) should be getting enough income so that they can afford a modest standard of living for themselves and a family too Can I ask... Why? Shouldn't a "minimum" wage provide a "minimal" lifestyle rather than a modest lifestyle? And why should one be able to support a family on a single minimum wage?

Because single mothers exist, so supporting a family on one income is needed to ensure a minimal amount of suffering happens to children who didn't ask to be poor, and have no way of opting out of poverty. Also, modest = minimal by the original standards. Historical context: https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/minimum_wage

It's much better to identify single mothers and make sure their kids are OK with welfare than make the national minimum wage enough to do so.

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The restaurant should pay more than minimum wage. Perhaps, but it sounds more like that your minimum wage isn't set to be a living wage[1]. That's the important part - minimum wages should be set so that someone who is working full time (~40 hours/week) should be getting enough income so that they can afford a modest standard of living for themselves and a family too. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_wage

> minimum wages should be set so that someone who is working full time (~40 hours/week) should be getting enough income so that they can afford a modest standard of living for themselves and a family too Can I ask... Why? Shouldn't a "minimum" wage provide a "minimal" lifestyle rather than a modest lifestyle? And why should one be able to support a family on a single minimum wage?

"modest" doesn't mean driving Teslas and eating out every night.

It means being able to afford the basics: housing, food, healthcare, transport, and still being able to have enough left over to build a 'rainy day' (emergency) fund.

And the reason "modest" rather than "minimal" is because one is living, the other is effective slavery.

People who cannot afford for one moment to stop are people who are on the edge of disaster. Any (additional) misfortune that strikes - whether by their own actions or not - could send them from "surviving" to now being forced into debt, which while it might provide temporary relief, almost certainly means they are now in a downward cycle.

With a living wage, even if misfortune does drive them into debt - there's at least a better opportunity for them to work their way out.

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because single mothers exist, so supporting a family on one income is needed to ensure a minimal amount of suffering happens to children who didn't ask to be poor, and have no way of opting out of poverty. Also, modest = minimal by the original standards. Historical context: https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/minimum_wage

It's much better to identify single mothers and make sure their kids are OK with welfare than make the national minimum wage enough to do so.

Better for whom?

Re: Casualties of the Cashless Society: Those Who Get Seasonal Tips

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's much better to identify single mothers and make sure their kids are OK with welfare than make the national minimum wage enough to do so.

Better for whom?

Better for the people paying the wages and the other consumers of those people's goods and services, and for workers who are employable only at particularly low wages.
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