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What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

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Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#41

Post by danieltillett »

I think the most interesting thing about the recent debate is our true rulers must be getting worried that things are getting out of control. They have not forgotten about the Reign of Terror [0] or where this sort of thing can lead. There is the real risk the masses actually might not be distracted by the usual left/right pointless bickering and actually follow the money.

0. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reign_of_Terror

Edit. Good to see what the real topic is you can't discuss in SV ;)

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#42

Post by [deleted] »

Cookingboy wrote: post #31
spiznnx wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really something that can be well summarized in a hn comment, but basically, it re-enforces the idea that men and women are actually so different that you have to be a certain gender just to do something you want to do (gender essentialism). My main point is, if it were acceptable, my s.o. would have a blog post about it that I could just link you to.

Jesus, that logic just broke my brain, and I'm not saying that dismissively. Now I need to really think about this...

[deleted]

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#43

Post by edmccard »

spiznnx wrote: post #27
ggg9990 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why something becomes "unacceptable to society" just because it "poses a threat to feminist aims." What's the first principles reason why it should be unacceptable?

It's not really something that can be well summarized in a hn comment, but basically, it re-enforces the idea that men and women are actually so different that you have to be a certain gender just to do something you want to do (gender essentialism). My main point is, if it were acceptable, my s.o. would have a blog post about it that I could just link you to.

>basically, it re-enforces the idea that men and women are actually so different that you have to be a certain gender just to do something you want to do (gender essentialism)

Do you think there's a difference between thinking you have to be a woman because you want (for example) to be a nurse, and thinking you have to be a woman because you want to be a woman?

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#44

Post by rdiddly »

The "taboo" list is surprisingly run-of-the-mill. All of it seems like stuff I see people discussing on the internet all the time. I thought there might be a few original thoughts, but even the things they claim they can't say are things they're kind of supposed to think. Different sides of boring issues.

Anyway rest assured there's no need to stifle heretical ideas with these people. The ones thinking anything truly original were probably either the ones left out of the 108, or never bothered answering or are already in institutions etc.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#45

Post by paloaltokid »

briandear wrote: post #37
aestetix wrote: post #28

What I read about the current climate in the US reminds me a lot of how things were in the months after 9/11. While I don't have unbiased data like in the link, I can share a personal anecdote: In the months after 9/11, if you spoke up and said you didn't agree with US foreign policy (invading Afghanistan) or that you didn't approve of Bush and wanted him to resign, you got blacklisted. I had a friend, every house in…

Try putting up a Ted Cruz sign in Mountain View.

That’d be kinda silly since Ted Cruz is a Texas senator. But if you mean for President, probably you’d take some heat.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#46

Post by SCdF »

spiznnx wrote: post #22

My S.O. thinks that transgender thought poses a threat to feminist aims and should not be acceptable to society, and has some really good arguments. I'm starting to be convinced, but I really can't discuss it with anyone else. edit: goodnight as its getting late.

Is that argument really relevant? Aren't they human beings who don't chose to be transgender? So, their existence is their right. It's not a political position, or a favourite flavour of icecream, it's a human state of being.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#47

Post by rdiddly »

aestetix wrote: post #28

What I read about the current climate in the US reminds me a lot of how things were in the months after 9/11. While I don't have unbiased data like in the link, I can share a personal anecdote: In the months after 9/11, if you spoke up and said you didn't agree with US foreign policy (invading Afghanistan) or that you didn't approve of Bush and wanted him to resign, you got blacklisted. I had a friend, every house in…

And that is why we won't stop fascism - people are too in love with it!

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#48

Post by ggg9990 »

spiznnx wrote: post #27
ggg9990 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why something becomes "unacceptable to society" just because it "poses a threat to feminist aims." What's the first principles reason why it should be unacceptable?

It's not really something that can be well summarized in a hn comment, but basically, it re-enforces the idea that men and women are actually so different that you have to be a certain gender just to do something you want to do (gender essentialism). My main point is, if it were acceptable, my s.o. would have a blog post about it that I could just link you to.

Yes, you should listen to the Gondolier episode of Radiolab. But if transgender people feel that that is true, and maybe it is true, and maybe it does weaken feminist goals... Why should the impact on feminist goals be relevant to the conversation? I.e., is society's benchmark the advancement of feminism?

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#49

Post by olavk »

As someone living far away from SV, this is fascinating reading. But I think the survey could be more precise about what "can't say" really means. Will you get literally ostracized for holding the viewpoint in private or on a blog, or will you get fired for bringing it up in the workplace?

I personally believe some viewpoints really are inappropriate to bring up in a professional working environment. If I genuinely believe read-headed people have a brain structure which makes them inferior developers, I don't think I should bring this issue up during a meeting. Sure, my red-headed coworkers have the option of challenging my viewpoints and perhaps a fruitful discussion will follow - where I will convince them with rational arguments and evidence that my viewpoint is correct. But I think it is fair if said red-headed colleagues would prefer not to have the discussion at all.

I notice the top taboo subjects are diversity, racism, sexism etc - exactly subjects where you can indirectly question a colleagues competence.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#50

Post by blfr »

rdiddly wrote: post #44

The "taboo" list is surprisingly run-of-the-mill. All of it seems like stuff I see people discussing on the internet all the time. I thought there might be a few original thoughts, but even the things they claim they can't say are things they're kind of supposed to think. Different sides of boring issues. Anyway rest assured there's no need to stifle heretical ideas with these people. The ones thinking anything truly…

These cannot be original ideas because they must have been expressed a few times before people learned you shouldn't discuss them.
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