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What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

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Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#21

Post by briandear »

EmilStenstrom wrote: post #15

There's a big difference between ideas that weaken minorities, and ideas that weaken majorities, because you get blowback for different reasons. When you attack minorities the people that get upset with you, are people that are worried that weakening an already weak group is a bad thing. When you attack majorities however, you get blowback from the people that are afraid to lose their power. I agree that there are pr…

Why weaken anyone? It isn’t zero sum. The free market has nothing to do with minorities or majorities: people don’t care about the race of a person selling them bread — they just want the cheapest bread at the highest quality.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#23

Post by tstactplsignore »

evangelista wrote: post #11

“A lot of the ideas here will not actually get you ostracized from Silicon Valley society.” Oh dude you have just not been paying attention. Can you show me a single example of someone in tech who publicly expresses, at any point, any of the beliefs which are “not allowed?” I’m looking for one. Find me one person on Twitter in tech aside from John McAfee or Peter Theil who would dare. Sam Altman was good enough to st…

I don't think I could convince you of anything. But can I ask: if the other side were right, and some of these views are so abhorrent that the outrage against people who express them is almost entirely justified- would you be able to tell?

There are definitely some political views that should be socially discouraged and attacked and there should be social repercussions for the people who express them. You disagree on whether some particular views fit in this category. You must admit that from your position, it can be very difficult to distinguish between unfair persecution and genuine persecution.

For the record, if a company I work for invited someone as purely evil / anti-intellectual and vapid as Scott Adams to give a speech, I would absolutely resign in protest.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#24

Post by spiznnx »

vxNsr wrote: post #3

So basically people with opinions on both extremes feel marginalized and unheard. I guess that's maybe a message to consider a more nuanced position.

I want Silicon Valley to be a place where you can publicly hold extreme views and not be a huge social liability to anyone you associate with (employer, friends).

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#25

Post by ggg9990 »

spiznnx wrote: post #22

My S.O. thinks that transgender thought poses a threat to feminist aims and should not be acceptable to society, and has some really good arguments. I'm starting to be convinced, but I really can't discuss it with anyone else. edit: goodnight as its getting late.

I'm not sure why something becomes "unacceptable to society" just because it "poses a threat to feminist aims." What's the first principles reason why it should be unacceptable?

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#26

Post by kazagistar »

EmilStenstrom wrote: post #15

There's a big difference between ideas that weaken minorities, and ideas that weaken majorities, because you get blowback for different reasons. When you attack minorities the people that get upset with you, are people that are worried that weakening an already weak group is a bad thing. When you attack majorities however, you get blowback from the people that are afraid to lose their power. I agree that there are pr…

(I'm going to assume from context you don't mean minority as in population, but rather power dynamics as you talk about for the rest of the post.) The problem distinguishing stronger and weaker sides is that there isn't an objective metric that both sides can agree on. The reason gender issues are so prevalent on this list and are such a hot topic is exactly because it is a debate about which side is weaker, about which measures of power are valid and invalid, and so on.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#27

Post by spiznnx »

ggg9990 wrote: post #25
spiznnx wrote: post #22

My S.O. thinks that transgender thought poses a threat to feminist aims and should not be acceptable to society, and has some really good arguments. I'm starting to be convinced, but I really can't discuss it with anyone else. edit: goodnight as its getting late.

I'm not sure why something becomes "unacceptable to society" just because it "poses a threat to feminist aims." What's the first principles reason why it should be unacceptable?

It's not really something that can be well summarized in a hn comment, but basically, it re-enforces the idea that men and women are actually so different that you have to be a certain gender just to do something you want to do (gender essentialism).

My main point is, if it were acceptable, my s.o. would have a blog post about it that I could just link you to.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#28

Post by aestetix »

What I read about the current climate in the US reminds me a lot of how things were in the months after 9/11. While I don't have unbiased data like in the link, I can share a personal anecdote:

In the months after 9/11, if you spoke up and said you didn't agree with US foreign policy (invading Afghanistan) or that you didn't approve of Bush and wanted him to resign, you got blacklisted.

I had a friend, every house in his neighborhood had an American flag except for his, because his dad was an introverted engineer and uninterested in politics. The absence of the flag was obvious, and after a few nights of things like eggs on the door, flaming dog shit, and finally a dead animal left on the door mat, he put up an American flag and all the drama went away.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#29

Post by Cookingboy »

bdamm wrote: post #8

"Silicon Valley" is a workplace, and it's generally considered rude to bring your political views into the workplace. Everyone has met the very passionate on both the left and the right, and having someone stand outside your cube or in the lunch line trying to "win" you over to their view just isn't conducive to getting your work done and making money.

>"Silicon Valley" is a workplace, and it's generally considered rude to bring your political views into the workplace.

In theory, yes, but in practice it's only considered "rude" when you bring unpopular political views into the workplace. In a partisan locale such as SV people openly talk about the popular political view at work, all the time.

A Googler can go to TGIF Q&A and openly bash Trump/GOP and he'd get sympathetic responses from Larry, if not cheers from the audience (and a bunch of new memegen entries), but I highly doubt the same would be true for someone expressing opposite views.

Re: What People Think You Can’t Say in Silicon Valley

#30

Post by RU9x8wHmjH8m6Nm »

bdamm wrote: post #8

"Silicon Valley" is a workplace, and it's generally considered rude to bring your political views into the workplace. Everyone has met the very passionate on both the left and the right, and having someone stand outside your cube or in the lunch line trying to "win" you over to their view just isn't conducive to getting your work done and making money.

Totally agree with respect to irrelevant political views.

But sometimes sensitive topics become relevant in the workplace (e.g. diversity in hiring). If any suggested divergence from the party line is repudiated, we risk losing objectivity.

An open mind easily discards a bad idea. A closed mind may miss a good one.

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