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Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

elaineou.com

221–230 of 307 posts

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#221
post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The indefinite perpetuation of a one-sided wrong does not make a right, either. Relentless oppression must be broken.

>Relentless oppression must be broken. I am going to quote the man who has arguably done the most to end oppression in the USA. "Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - MLKJ

Defend the unjust status quo, squealing at the most minor affronts and drawing false equivalencies. It will last as long as you live, and you'll never give up. Society will just have to leave you behind.

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be clear here. We're not talking about where to eat lunch or controversial scientific theories, a la Galileo or Darwin. We're talking about "is race X smarter than race Y", "is gender X smarter than Y". Bigoted ideas. Some have been comfortable espousing bigoted views. Now they are forced to think about what they say and how they say it. As a white man, this has affected my own behavior (for the better IMO): I'…

> We're talking about "is race X smarter than race Y", "is gender X smarter than Y". Bigoted ideas. Let's hypothetically say that a sapient alien species, with the full range of emotions and thoughts a human being can have, was discovered that was also demonstrably not as smart as human beings after centuries of scientific study. Would saying "humans are smarter than these aliens" be bigoted? Flip it around. If diffe…

I don't have a dog in this fight, but what irks me is how, on the one hand, one can claim to accept evolution, a process that works precisely by variation and natural selection, and at the same time rule out, not the actuality, but the very possibility IN PRINCIPLE that there can ever be statistically significant sexual or ethnic variation. If you are of a secularist, materialist bent, you are absolutely bound to accept that possibility lest you fall into holding incoherent beliefs.

To be clear, I am neither rejecting evolution nor advocating racism or sexism. I am merely pointing out that secularism-materialism binds you to accept the very real possibility of things being true about sex, race, ethnicity, etc, that those holding secularist, materialistic views categorically and in principle reject (at least verbally, if not in action) as a matter of principle even though they are bound BY THE VERY PRINCIPLES THEY CLAIM TO HOLD to accept these things as possibilities, if not present actualities.

This is but one of many absurdities in vogue in circles like the SV circuit and its allies. You can't have your cake and eat it, too, and you can be sure that repeating mantras and going on the offensive only works for so long. You have to reexamine your foundational beliefs. The truth will, sooner or later, exact its revenge and come for its pound of flesh. The tension forces of contradiction will cause the facade to cave no matter how much stucco you use to conceal the growing cracks.

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#223
post #179
post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the usual reasons: user flags, software, and a moderation penalty. The latter can vary in weight but at the moment is a small downweight applied to follow-up discussions that don't contain significant new information. The software involved is HN's flamewar detector a.k.a. overheated discussion detector. All of these are typical responses to articles with a large heat-to-substance ratio.

> All of these are typical responses to articles with a large heat-to-substance ratio. To save others from having to look it up themselves: according to [0], it took 13 hours for Sam's article to fall off the front page, while this article fell off after about 1 hour. dang didn't say it was ONLY heat-to-substance ratio causing the downmod. Clearly, there are other factors than heat-to-substance ratio causing it thoug…

Downmods and flagging aside, it's at least a positive sign that these article that don't toe the line of the current groupthink keep being posted and keep getting upvoted. Don't lose hope; keep upvoting and arguing for the positions you believe in.

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#225
post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Relentless oppression must be broken. I am going to quote the man who has arguably done the most to end oppression in the USA. "Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - MLKJ

Defend the unjust status quo, squealing at the most minor affronts and drawing false equivalencies. It will last as long as you live, and you'll never give up. Society will just have to leave you behind.

Many of the opinions listed in this article are held by sometimes a majority of the population, so this is not about the rule of the many because if so you could legislate this and resolve it through the courts. As MLK said, you do not drive out darkness with darkness.

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The White Nationalist march on Charlotte is actually an example of voices being silenced. Photos of people there were distributed, their names were found (sometimes incorrectly), and their places of work contacted. Then they were fired. If people see that people who share the same views are losing their livelihoods, they are more likely to be silent. Only the independently wealthy wouldn't consider losing their job r…

That's a good point to bring up. I don't think those people were silenced. They went to a public protest in a public place to make a statement. That statement was broadcast across the country and the world. The opposite of being silenced. Now, they faced consequences for what they said. But that's what happens when you say things. Words have meaning and you can say words which will cause people to no longer want to a…

> Now, they faced consequences for what they said.

And what of those who were incorrectly identified by the vigilantes? Do their fates not matter?

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Voices are being silenced. I think we've got to be cautious in defining what "being silenced" means. Because I see a world in which people are saying all sorts of things out loud. There was a protest with a bunch of people waving Nazi flags in a public park in Virginia a few months ago. I don't think people are being silenced. I think community norms are shifting quickly in many parts of the country and, again, it'…

“Silenced” here means any manner of active suppression (shaming, ridiculing, verbal abuse, social bullying, even physical violence, etc) of an idea, rather than simply (1) ignoring it on a personal level, or (2) responding to it with argument via evidence and reason. If an idea we disagree with is rare or harmless, we often ignore it. If an idea we disagree with is more common and worth refuting, we should respond to…

Rational argument doesn't scale, bots and memes scale. Blocklists do scale, and it's only because identity platforms (fb, twitter) are also locked down content control platforms that we haven't seen more global blocklists.

I fully expect decentralised social behaviour blocklists to emerge in the near future. Who would want to (employ/socialise with/do business with) a (trumptard/libtard)? Why take the risk of employing someone with racist tendencies, etc.

It might even use a distributed cryptographic ledger.

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#228
I'm glad this submission was flagged as I've done so as well out of sheer disbelief. It's baffling why somebody who spent so much time building up their reputation would throw it under the bus for ideological cause. You can say anything you want, write what you want in SV but do not mistake people distancing from you afterwards as 'silencing' you. If somebody goes around saying it's okay to love Trump, as a women AND as a minority is just pure mind fuckery.

I can see why some people feel threatened by the sudden rise of opinions that differ from the mainstream narration but this is precisely because the silenced voices are SPEAKING UP.

The most bizarre part about this is that a minority female would openly become a doormat for the very people that told everybody who wasn't like them to shut the fuck up....

This is hardcore Uncle Toming from a woman who wouldn't be viewed as a white women by mainstream America but through the lens of fetish. Especially, shaming another Asian American women like Ellen Pao to further her article's message.

I apologize for any harsh words but as a minority myself, it was hard to contain the anger.

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Defend the unjust status quo, squealing at the most minor affronts and drawing false equivalencies. It will last as long as you live, and you'll never give up. Society will just have to leave you behind.

Many of the opinions listed in this article are held by sometimes a majority of the population, so this is not about the rule of the many because if so you could legislate this and resolve it through the courts. As MLK said, you do not drive out darkness with darkness.

Those who decry darkness by the oppressed yet tolerate darkness by the dominant are not fit to quote MLK.

Re: Stuff You Can't Say in Silicon Valley

#230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a good point to bring up. I don't think those people were silenced. They went to a public protest in a public place to make a statement. That statement was broadcast across the country and the world. The opposite of being silenced. Now, they faced consequences for what they said. But that's what happens when you say things. Words have meaning and you can say words which will cause people to no longer want to a…

> Now, they faced consequences for what they said. And what of those who were incorrectly identified by the vigilantes? Do their fates not matter?

"Of course we shouldn't say people said things they never actually said. But that's not what we're talking about." - Abraham Lincoln
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