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MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

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Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#21

Post by icelancer »

superquest wrote: post #4

> "Nobody actually transacts in cryptocurrency," Goldbard says. "So making something that people can actually use is our first goal. And then we want to find additional ways that people can implement it over time. But initially all we want is to make it so people can actually complete transactions." Amen. Too few projects have this focus.

> "Nobody actually transacts in cryptocurrency," Goldbard says. "So making something that people can actually use is our first goal. And then we want to find additional ways that people can implement it over time. But initially all we want is to make it so people can actually complete transactions."

This is being solved by Shapeshift.io and XMR.to. I transact in cryptocurrency all the time using these intermediary services with BTC as the usual medium of exchange. It's opened my skeptical eyes about the future of how things will work.

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#22

Post by chatmasta »

ajennings wrote: post #8

Wow. MM is really going all-in on for Software Guard Extensions (secure enclave) on the server. What does HN say? Do we trust Intel (motivation and implementation) that much?

In multiple verticals of the industry, there exists a clear trend of utilizing hardware security modules for cryptographic operations. Almost all mobile phones have them, cloud providers offer HSM services, and Trezor wallets generate bitcoin private keys. It makes sense to build a service that relies heavily on HSM.

Adapt or die

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#23

Post by icelancer »

superquest wrote: post #18
tuccinator wrote: post #15

I feel like the real appeal of Bitcoin is the decentralized aspect. I am not totally intrigued at the idea of having a controlled system, even if it offers complete privacy and faster transaction speed.

Something like this could make sense for "petty cash spending"

I believe that was the intent of Stellar.

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#24

Post by mtgx »

ajennings wrote: post #8

Wow. MM is really going all-in on for Software Guard Extensions (secure enclave) on the server. What does HN say? Do we trust Intel (motivation and implementation) that much?

No, but probably worth a shot. I think AMD's Secure Encrypted Virtualization (SEV) sounded better, though. But it's a shame AMD only offers it on the EPYC server chips. they ought to make it a mainstream feature in Zen 2 chips if they want it to gain popularity and use. That said, that's probably not an obstacle for a company that plans on using server chips anyway.

https://developer.amd.com/amd-secure-memory-encryption-sme-a...

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#25

Post by Confiks »

To repeat an earlier comment, this scheme encourages a centralization of trust into a private key managed by processor manufacturers. You might say that by integrating SGX mechanisms into your security model, you create a set of 'feudal lords' [1] who can wield their power over you.

A manufacturer may 'legitimately' establish an enclave in your most trusted hardware which you may not audit or even measure. And if that security model becomes commonplace, for example when only allowing Widevine DRM inside SGX, you eventually cannot use your self-chosen hardware, but will have to pick a feudal lord from a limited set of 'ecosystem choices'.

[1] https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2013/06/more_on_feuda...

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#26

Post by kyledrake »

ajennings wrote: post #8

Wow. MM is really going all-in on for Software Guard Extensions (secure enclave) on the server. What does HN say? Do we trust Intel (motivation and implementation) that much?

At the end of the day, trust is still required. For example, if you use Bitcoin, you're trusting the people that wrote the code and the libraries it linked to and the people that ran the server you downloaded it from, and you're trusting that Koblitz didn't put a backdoor into the ECC somehow. I could go on for a while here but I think this describes the basic idea. You can change the level of trust required or who you're trusting but not the mere requirement of it.

I've met some of the people working on this at Intel and I do have confidence that this isn't some conspiracy, I do think they have the intention of improving the crypto space with projects like this.

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#27

Post by eridius »

berberous wrote: post #14

1) Both Kin and MobileCoin have moved to Stellar as their back end this week. I haven't paid Stellar much attention before. Anyone have any good links that explains Stellar and/or discusses the technical pros/cons? Trying to avoid any shill/pump or baseless FUD. 2) Am I correct that if any vulnerability were found in the SGX, an attacker would gain access to the encrypted private keys that are stored on a server node…

I don't have a good link for Stellar but it's been around for a while, and the Rust creator even worked for them for some time.

Regarding the second point, since it's on the server, wouldn't a vulnerability just mean the server operator might potentially be able to get at the keys, not any random attacker?

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#28

Post by superquest »

icelancer wrote: post #21
superquest wrote: post #4

> "Nobody actually transacts in cryptocurrency," Goldbard says. "So making something that people can actually use is our first goal. And then we want to find additional ways that people can implement it over time. But initially all we want is to make it so people can actually complete transactions." Amen. Too few projects have this focus.

> "Nobody actually transacts in cryptocurrency," Goldbard says. "So making something that people can actually use is our first goal. And then we want to find additional ways that people can implement it over time. But initially all we want is to make it so people can actually complete transactions." This is being solved by Shapeshift.io and XMR.to. I transact in cryptocurrency all the time using these intermediary se…

https://xmr.to/ looks waaaay too complicated for the average person to use, which is a nonstarter for the average person.

And it still processes a Bitcoin transaction, correct? So it will be no faster than Bitcoin?

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#29

Post by joyce »

berberous wrote: post #14

1) Both Kin and MobileCoin have moved to Stellar as their back end this week. I haven't paid Stellar much attention before. Anyone have any good links that explains Stellar and/or discusses the technical pros/cons? Trying to avoid any shill/pump or baseless FUD. 2) Am I correct that if any vulnerability were found in the SGX, an attacker would gain access to the encrypted private keys that are stored on a server node…

Here is a link to the blog post when the Stellar Consensus Protocol was released. It includes a summary in Stellar's own words and a link to the white paper: https://www.stellar.org/blog/stellar-consensus-protocol-proo...

Re: MobileCoin: A New Cryptocurrency from Moxie Marlinspike

#30

Post by eridius »

tuccinator wrote: post #15

I feel like the real appeal of Bitcoin is the decentralized aspect. I am not totally intrigued at the idea of having a controlled system, even if it offers complete privacy and faster transaction speed.

If it works like Stellar (which it sounds like it does), it's still a decentralized network of nodes, but each individual user isn't a node. They pick a node to work with, and that node is then connected to a set of other nodes. Anyone can run a node, but there's just not any point to it for most users.
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