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People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

blogs.scientificamerican.com

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Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#91

Post by hycaria »

emodendroket wrote: post #83
hycaria wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It makes you think about it and sensibilize to it. Which probably failed by you considering : >On topic: I have little doubt there's a strong link between climate change in general and the production and consumption of livestock. The most common cow diet at the moment is 50kg of corn + 3 kg of soy + maybe 10kg (dry) of hay. Everyday. Do you think this grows out of the blue or uses arable land ? Also Europe imports so…

I don't get what you mean. It doesn't seem like you actually disagree with the snippet you're quoting, yet it seems like you're trying to refute it.

I can't read, sorry :p

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#92

Post by hycaria »

emodendroket wrote: post #84
hycaria wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Today I just ate one with tofu cooked in sauce and green beans (yeah soy has its own problems, at least in europe where we don't produce it). But you can also have beans / chick pea or even greens baked into fritters. I always liked the eggs mayo combo (adding tomato cucumber or whatever), but this is not vegan.

I mean, to be completely honest with you, at this point I do not want to eat a sandwich at all.

No worries, I don't envy your prejudices and close mindedness, and I have no doubt that our world won't leave you much choice later on :)

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#93

Post by lozenge »

melling wrote: post #72
lozenge wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of China's CO2 production is to create goods that are purchased by the US and other developed countries. http://m.pnas.org/content/107/12/5687 And yes, some 15% of humans' GHG production can be attributed to meat.

The first line states this: “CO2 emissions from the burning of fossil fuels are the primary cause of global warming” China uses almost much coal as the rest of the world combined: https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=16271 That chart seems to correlate with China’s emission increases: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_...

I don't disagree, I'm just pointing out that a lot of China's coal use is to power factories that export goods to the US. If China used anything other than the cheapest energy for their factories, you would be seeing "made in India/some other country more willing to pollute to save us a few cents" a lot more in Wal-Mart.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#94

Post by emodendroket »

hycaria wrote: post #92
emodendroket wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, to be completely honest with you, at this point I do not want to eat a sandwich at all.

No worries, I don't envy your prejudices and close mindedness, and I have no doubt that our world won't leave you much choice later on :)

I'm pretty sure even in the hypothetical brave meatless future I will not be compelled to only eat recipes that work much better with meat.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#95

Post by emodendroket »

ryanwaggoner wrote: post #53
mrarjen wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's more expensive the less eco friendly ways of making meat will be consumed instead.

Such as? You think if meat in the US doubled or tripled in price there’d be a black market that would overwhelm those gains? I really doubt that you have any evidence for that.

You're talking past each other because he is imagining some kind of more sustainable meat coexisting with traditional production in the market and you're imagining only this new kind of meat being available for purchase.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#96

Post by hycaria »

emodendroket wrote: post #94
hycaria wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No worries, I don't envy your prejudices and close mindedness, and I have no doubt that our world won't leave you much choice later on :)

I'm pretty sure even in the hypothetical brave meatless future I will not be compelled to only eat recipes that work much better with meat.

You're not going to have a Tbone steak without beef, it's true. So you can't have a beef burger without beef, but you can have other flavors of sandwiches that are absolutely tasty too (and can be as fat and unhealthy as meat options btw). Also many recipes do work without meat : I do a kick ass lasagna and stuffed tomatoes. Anything with minced meat basically is not that much reliant on the meat for taste and can be easily replaced with textured soy (closest in taste but also seitan or beans or whatever).

But then again, I don't understand how one can hate food before even trying it, and how one can be so adverse against acting towards a brighter future for everyone, here by having meatless meals more often.

edit : Luckily, I just saw that while you're the most adamant, you're also the single user with such a behavior on this thread, so I still have hope that others will be more receptive.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#97

Post by [deleted] »

emodendroket wrote: post #87
cagenut wrote: post #50

Meat is a big one, but its the #3 - #5ish big one depending on how you look at things (at an individual westerner vs. other lenses). Roughly in order it goes - having more kids than adults (population growth) - living in a single-family detached home (land use sprawl + hvac inefficiency) - owning a car - flying - eating red meat (particularly beef & lamb) So yes by all means, eat less red meat, but after you've moved…

Oh, good news, you can just ditch the car and walk several miles to everywhere you need to go. Again, telling people to just start living like they're Benedictine monks is not a serious solution to the problem.

[deleted]

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#98

Post by emodendroket »

hycaria wrote: post #96
emodendroket wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure even in the hypothetical brave meatless future I will not be compelled to only eat recipes that work much better with meat.

You're not going to have a Tbone steak without beef, it's true. So you can't have a beef burger without beef, but you can have other flavors of sandwiches that are absolutely tasty too (and can be as fat and unhealthy as meat options btw). Also many recipes do work without meat : I do a kick ass lasagna and stuffed tomatoes. Anything with minced meat basically is not that much reliant on the meat for taste and can be…

I don't think you're really following me. There are any number of meatless foods I like -- for instance, pasta with sauce (well, not vegan, and the sauce might have fish broth or something, but still), steamed or stir-fried green vegetables, ma po tofu (usually has pork but it can work without it), whatever. But I find the idea of a sandwich with tofu in place of meat repellent and I'd really rather just give up on the sandwich and have a recipe designed from the start to be vegetarian, rather than one designed to have meat but with a lousy substitute.

> I don't understand how one can hate food before even trying it

Are you completely without the power of imagination? Do you need to try it to know whether you would like pizza with marshmallows and miniature Snickers bars on top?

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#99

Post by TheCoelacanth »

hycaria wrote: post #70
jp555 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All that would happen is people would quickly aclimate to killing their dinner. We did it for humdreds of thousands of years , it’s part of our genetic make up.

That was never our primary source of food though.

Yes, because it was too expensive, but it has always been a significant dietary compenent. Most people historically have eaten meat when they could get it, and for most of them the slaughtering of the animals was very few degrees of separation from them. Either they did it themselves, someone in their family did it, someone they directly employed did it or they bought or traded for it directly from someone who did it.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#100

Post by emodendroket »

hycaria wrote: post #69
peg_leg wrote: post #30

Meat is cheap. AND it's not up to individuals to make the broad policy changes needed to affect climate change. That's done by governments. People will follow suit. If there's a tax on meat, less meat will be eaten. To put the onus on individuals to make policy decisions is preposterous.

While I agree these are not popular enough to get elected on or to introduce and no one wants to commit political suicide. Hell even wildlife protection or ecological associations barely mention these subjects as it drives people away from donations.

If it's not popular enough to get over the finish line in elections how's it supposed to sudden gain so much traction that everyone changes their lifestyles?
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