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F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

nytimes.com

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Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#711

Post by criddell »

pishpash wrote: post #357
noetic_techy wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I totally agree. Who cares if the worst case scenario is tiered pricing, as long as their is REAL competition, a competitor can come along and say "we offer it all for one flat fee because our infrastructure is better." Boom, done. These municipal exclusion deals are the real problem. I also think this is going to backfire and bite the telco's in the ass if they try to roll out tiers. The legislative outcry when joe…

A rather naïve reading. People are stupid. They may even prefer the "simplicity" of tiered packages. They'll roll over.

I predict the first package is going to be a gamer package. Image a low latency / high bandwidth connection tuned for gaming. Lots of people would pay $10 or $15 per month for that if it would give them an advantage in gaming.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#712

Post by arca_vorago »

kuschku wrote: post #617
mijowi wrote: post #556

It's not democratic. It's republican. Remember that America is a republic, not a democracy. Each state has 2 senators/electoral votes because this country was founded as the United States. It was supposed to be more of a coalition of states united under a federal government, than a single nation. Also, California has a huge population with tons of representatives, and basically every elected official is democratic. I…

> Remember that America is a republic, not a democracy Republic. Aka, Res Publica. "Thing of the people". A form of government where all political power originates with the people, directly or indirectly. Democracy. Demos Kratia. "Rule by the people". A form of government where all political power originates with the people, directly or indirectly. These two terms are not about how decisions are made. They do not dis…

I just want to correct this now and say the United States of America is a constitutional democratic republic form of government. This distinction matters.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#713

Post by CalChris »

X86BSD wrote: post #709
CalChris wrote: post #518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The voters elected a Republican government. The Electors elected a Republican government. The voters elected a Democrat by 2,868,691 votes and there was Russian meddling on top of even that. Associating any popular mandate with that is shear nonsense.

I’ve seen no proof of Russian meddling that had any provable effect on the election. Only theoretical. Second do you have ANY idea how many elections the US has “meddled” in? Let alone how many leaders we have literally overthrown?? Get some perspective. If you don’t like other nations pissing in our oatmeal I seriously suggest we stop pissing, shitting, and vomiting in theirs. Golden rule and all. Let the booing beg…

I guess it's only a theory that Cheeto's National Security Advisor Michael Flynn pled guilty to lying to the FBI about his Russian contacts.

Really.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#714

Post by Consultant32452 »

JohnTHaller wrote: post #436
komali2 wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been thinking this over for the past couple months, because I was pretty sure this would be the outcome - that we would lose our net neutrality protection. So let's play out the worse case - Comcast, AT&T etc wait out the shitstorm and then start throttling traffic and packaging the internet, releasing cable-esque "plans." Is it feasible to just start running our own fiber to hubs? I want to learn more about the…

No, it isn't. I live in NYC. I have access to exactly one broadband provider. So, if Spectrum starts blocking Vonage because they want you to pay for their VoIP instead (ISPs in the US have done this in the past), I'll have to drop Vonage and use Spectrum's VoIP. Repeat for blocking P2P, Google Wallet, Facetime, Netflix, etc (all of which have previous incidents in the US).

I believe the FTC, the government agency responsible for going after unfair trade practices, already covers the scenarios you're worried about.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#715

Post by anigbrowl »

komali2 wrote: post #300
juris wrote: post #135

This wouldn't be a problem if ISP's weren't de facto monopolies. If there was competition in this space, then there would be incentive to improve the infrastructure and Internet speeds. However, ISP's kill competition by making legal arrangements with local governments to only do business with them, and by cutting competitors' cables. Since we have no way to guarantee reasonable speeds to small time websites now, we…

I've been thinking this over for the past couple months, because I was pretty sure this would be the outcome - that we would lose our net neutrality protection. So let's play out the worse case - Comcast, AT&T etc wait out the shitstorm and then start throttling traffic and packaging the internet, releasing cable-esque "plans." Is it feasible to just start running our own fiber to hubs? I want to learn more about the…

Besides the costs, getting all those easements takes a lot of time, and often legal work. This is why crowdsourcing fiber hasn't taken off, it's a nice idea but you'll go through a ton of money on permits and legal filings before you buy a single spool of cable.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#716

Post by jonhuber »

dragonwriter wrote: post #676
jonhuber wrote: post #672

Net neutrality is the solution to a sub problem. Content companies having a monopoly on the last mile. We should really be pushing for structural separation and ownership rules of communications infrastructure, which I suppose is the end game of net neutrality anyways. Like roads, it doesn't necessarily make sense to have competition in the last mile space, two fibers/cables/etc running to the same dwelling. New Zeal…

> We should really be pushing for structural separation and ownership rules of communications infrastructure, which I suppose is the end game of net neutrality anyways. Right: eliminating the synergies between owning content and owning ISPs makes it so there is little reason for a firm to want to be both an ISP and a content provider; it won't instantly cause existing combined entities to split up, but firms seeking…

Well said, to that point we should at least be disincentivizing the combination of content and ISP.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#717

Post by X86BSD »

dragonwriter wrote: post #704
X86BSD wrote: post #699

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One day the people may wake up to realize some things. Like voting R or D does not matter because they share the same di5k to eff you with. There is no difference between the two parties. None. The rhetoric is different but the actual voting records show they are the same animal. Beholden to the same military industrial complex/corporate masters. They may also realize that if voting actually changed anything it would…

> There is no difference between the two parties. None. The rhetoric is different but the actual voting records show they are the same animal. Er, no, actual voting records of Congress and regulatory agencies like the FCC show a whole host of issues on which the parties are very different. Including, relevant to this discussion, the consistent absolute partisan split on net neutrality at the FCC.

How much of that do you believe is simply taking the other side by democracy’s because they hate republicans? Versus if the dems has the WH and both houses they would appoint another telecom shill and have done exactly the same thing?

That’s the party that tried to bring us the Clipper chip my friend. Think about that.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#718

Post by kuschku »

hueving wrote: post #693
kuschku wrote: post #617

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Remember that America is a republic, not a democracy Republic. Aka, Res Publica. "Thing of the people". A form of government where all political power originates with the people, directly or indirectly. Democracy. Demos Kratia. "Rule by the people". A form of government where all political power originates with the people, directly or indirectly. These two terms are not about how decisions are made. They do not dis…

Perhaps you should spend a little of time reading about the US form of government because what you described is very similar to the purpose of the House and the Senate. Barring gerrymandering issues, the house members are populous elected representatives with each state given weight based on its population. Then each state gets 2 senate seats which are elected within the states by popularity as well. Tldr; you've ess…

I’ve described what the US model would be ideally. But that’s not what it is today. The German system was designed after the US system (due to WWII, and everything after), but improved.

Gerrymandering is a real issue (the German model doesn’t have that), the house seats are effectively arbitrarily distributed, etc.

Re: F.C.C. Repeals Net Neutrality Rules

#720

Post by X86BSD »

CalChris wrote: post #713
X86BSD wrote: post #709

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve seen no proof of Russian meddling that had any provable effect on the election. Only theoretical. Second do you have ANY idea how many elections the US has “meddled” in? Let alone how many leaders we have literally overthrown?? Get some perspective. If you don’t like other nations pissing in our oatmeal I seriously suggest we stop pissing, shitting, and vomiting in theirs. Golden rule and all. Let the booing beg…

I guess it's only a theory that Cheeto's National Security Advisor Michael Flynn pled guilty to lying to the FBI about his Russian contacts. Really.

Even if that’s accurate how does that negate what I said about all of the Russian BS is just that BS. No proven election fraud, no voter fraud, nothing provable to russians.
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