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Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

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Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#31

I still don't see how UBI doesn't cause inflation enough to offset any benefit(in the near term ie before robot job apocalypses).

UBI is a fancy way of saying "take from the rich to give to the poor". It has to be combined with a progressive tax system to make sense.

This isn't even a bad thing from an economic standpoint. Capitalism has the problem where wealth tends to accumulate upward naturally (rich get richer just because they're rich and have a bit of financial sense) and eventually starves itself of demand. Re-injecting cash in the low end keeps the economy moving despite this natural tendency. UBI has the advantage of low administrative overhead too, so more of the money gets used on goods and services. Also, unlike Welfare there is no perceived disincentive to work.

That said, UBI has its problems. Prices at the low end are likely to go up simply due to lack of workers. If you have UBI why would you do backbreaking manual labor all day for minimum wage? To really work well it has to be paired with increasing automation of low end jobs to offset the labor imbalance, otherwise you end up with inflation as people are forced to pay higher wages to fruit pickers, fry cooks, etc... in a competitive job market. Or more likely, those jobs will move overseas at an increased rate to countries where the labor market is skewed towards employers and they can pay people well below the value they generate.

Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#32
> There would be still be very rich and poor people, but we could eliminate fear, suffering, and existential panic for a substantial part of the population. #6m28s

I actually laughed when I heard them say this, given their videos on things like the Fermi Paradox.

Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#33
post #20

Would UBI be available only for citizens or everyone living within the borders? Thoughts?

Ideally eventually it will be truly universal (at least on a global scale). In the short term, the question of "citizens only?" is a pretty big complication. It means countries that start UBI sooner will be incentivized either to discourage or restrict immigration, or to limit it to citizens.

Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#34

When it comes to UBI, there's an interesting psychological phenomenon. I believe that McDonald's and similar establishments could have automated away the vast majority of their work force years, maybe even decades ago. And yet there are still people working there. In fact, McDonald's is often viewed as many people's first entrance into the work force, and as a safety blanket if anything goes south (well worst case at…

In the US, the army is the social welfare.

Your argument about McD's fails because they are automating away their workforce with their self checkout systems.

Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#35

When it comes to UBI, there's an interesting psychological phenomenon. I believe that McDonald's and similar establishments could have automated away the vast majority of their work force years, maybe even decades ago. And yet there are still people working there. In fact, McDonald's is often viewed as many people's first entrance into the work force, and as a safety blanket if anything goes south (well worst case at…

Or possibly, service jobs are harder to automate than it appears? What evidence do you have that it's easy to automate?

In theory, you could replace a McDonalds with a vending machine, but it's not the same thing.

Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#36

First line: "What if the state covered the cost of living?" Who is paying for the income? It's not "The state". It's everyone else, by taxation. You're telling people you have a right to seize their earnings for their labor. You're literally taking someone else's money, and giving it to someone else. UBI is nothing but people ignoring the moral problems of seizing assets and saying "The end justifies the means." If a…

>You're literally taking someone else's money, and giving it to someone else.

You just decribed taxation in general. Should people be taxed at all? If so, should they have a say in how the money is spent?

Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#38

First line: "What if the state covered the cost of living?" Who is paying for the income? It's not "The state". It's everyone else, by taxation. You're telling people you have a right to seize their earnings for their labor. You're literally taking someone else's money, and giving it to someone else. UBI is nothing but people ignoring the moral problems of seizing assets and saying "The end justifies the means." If a…

You aren't complaining about UBI, you are complaining about taxes (yes, I get how they are related, but they aren't the same thing). We've long ago decided that we as a society are OK with taxes. If you don't want to pay them, go somewhere that doesn't make you pay them.

No, no he isn't. There is a difference between paying taxes so that the government can provide services and an A-B transfer.

For example, the government can, in some situations, seize land. The government is not generally allowed to then give that land to other citizens. There have been a couple of cases that came close to that, and if you read the majority opinions on them you'll see the logical foundations.

Re: Universal Basic Income Explained – Free Money for Everybody? [video]

#40

I still don't see how UBI doesn't cause inflation enough to offset any benefit(in the near term ie before robot job apocalypses).

Inflation is a monetary phenomenon. As long as you are paying for UBI through taxes rather than by printing money, there shouldn't be any overall inflation. Certainly there will be price adjustments: the prices of some things will go up while others will go down. But that definitely wont "offset any benefit".

That's assuming the people getting taxed are spending less on the same things (in the CPI) that people that are getting a surplus benefit are spending more on.

Otherwise the rich are investing less and the poor are spending more on consumption. asset prices go down cpi goes up.

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