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The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

cryptoizzy.blogspot.com

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Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#11

Post by djtriptych »

madamelic wrote: post #3
brndnmtthws wrote: post #2

I agree with the premise that fungibility is important to Bitcoin's success, but I disagree that Bitcoin is 'flawed' or has in some way lost to Monero. There was an update yesterday on the progress being made on privacy features in Bitcoin: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2017... On a related note, I am happy about the conservative and careful pace of development of Bitcoin. I don't want my st…

Bitcoin may not be dead but it is certainly being destroyed on its original purpose (being money). The only reason to hold Bitcoin is the naive hope that more suckers (not even a better word for them) pay you to hold something they think will go higher (again: suckers) There are networks that are faster / more secure than Bitcoin and therefore more valuable as usable money (which is what Bitcoin was supposed to be) B…

The size of the BTC network is a huge part of its value. It's already hard even for state actors to compromise the blockchain.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#12

Post by djtriptych »

jackmodern wrote: post #4
brndnmtthws wrote: post #2

I agree with the premise that fungibility is important to Bitcoin's success, but I disagree that Bitcoin is 'flawed' or has in some way lost to Monero. There was an update yesterday on the progress being made on privacy features in Bitcoin: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2017... On a related note, I am happy about the conservative and careful pace of development of Bitcoin. I don't want my st…

store of value adds very little value to the rest of the world yet to adopt it. buying bitcoin/sending it is more expensive than a wire transfer. this isn't what bitcoin was meant to be. I no longer use bitcoin for anything other than HODLing, LTC has completely displaced it for as a means of exchange. That seems like the more important problem to solve for mass adoption. Can't have people paying for food/goods with…

Bitcoin has a flat transaction rate for moving any amount of value. So yes, more expensive if the amount being transferred is low, and I mean really low.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#13

Post by illustrioussuit »

jackmodern wrote: post #4
brndnmtthws wrote: post #2

I agree with the premise that fungibility is important to Bitcoin's success, but I disagree that Bitcoin is 'flawed' or has in some way lost to Monero. There was an update yesterday on the progress being made on privacy features in Bitcoin: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2017... On a related note, I am happy about the conservative and careful pace of development of Bitcoin. I don't want my st…

store of value adds very little value to the rest of the world yet to adopt it. buying bitcoin/sending it is more expensive than a wire transfer. this isn't what bitcoin was meant to be. I no longer use bitcoin for anything other than HODLing, LTC has completely displaced it for as a means of exchange. That seems like the more important problem to solve for mass adoption. Can't have people paying for food/goods with…

Bitcoin Cash was a hard fork intended to solve the problem of fungibility. (Low fees, fast transactions, etc)

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#14

Post by unabridged »

Bitcoin is still in beta, new features can always be added. They are building something to last the rest of the century at least, so its going slow.

Plus even without adding anything, bitcoin -> monero -> bitcoin solves the privacy problem.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#15

Post by dfox »

djtriptych wrote: post #12
jackmodern wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

store of value adds very little value to the rest of the world yet to adopt it. buying bitcoin/sending it is more expensive than a wire transfer. this isn't what bitcoin was meant to be. I no longer use bitcoin for anything other than HODLing, LTC has completely displaced it for as a means of exchange. That seems like the more important problem to solve for mass adoption. Can't have people paying for food/goods with…

Bitcoin has a flat transaction rate for moving any amount of value. So yes, more expensive if the amount being transferred is low, and I mean really low.

Bitcoin's transaction fees are more complex than flat per transaction. It depends on the size of transaction which then in turn depends on how many incoming payments you have to combine into the amount of BTC you want to send. This has somewhat surprising and unfortunate high-level effect that the smaller transactions you do, the higher are fees for your future ones. The same is true for all cryptocurrencies where you spend transaction outputs (all bitcoin derived ones) instead of moving abstract numbers between "accounts" (ethereum), where the transaction fee is essentially flat and often insignificant. I'm not sure how Monero and Zcash works in this regard.

Edit: tl;dr: problem with bitcoin's transaction fees is that they are not flat, but instead depend on non-obvious technical details of the protocol.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#16

Post by badloginagain »

> How would you feel if you were required to print, in legible block letters, your full name on every dollar bill before you spent it?

I already do this with 99% of my purchases. I almost solely purchase through credit card, which is a contractual obligation that my clearly identified person will allow a financial institution to pay for this coffee on my behalf, on promise I will pay that institution back at a later time.

I fully expect that institution to carry a full record of my purchases, and these days I expect them to share some subset of that data with whoever they see fit. It's just the world we live in.

I never carry cash with me, except for the rare occasions I know I'll be going to a cashless enterprise, which is becoming exceedingly rare where I live.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#17

Post by mmanfrin »

unabridged wrote: post #14

Bitcoin is still in beta, new features can always be added. They are building something to last the rest of the century at least, so its going slow. Plus even without adding anything, bitcoin -> monero -> bitcoin solves the privacy problem.

  Bitcoin is still in beta
W h a t.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#18

Post by nategri »

unabridged wrote: post #14

Bitcoin is still in beta, new features can always be added. They are building something to last the rest of the century at least, so its going slow. Plus even without adding anything, bitcoin -> monero -> bitcoin solves the privacy problem.

Bitcoin is always fine. And the solution to bitcoin is always bitcoin. And in bitcoin, we'll bitcoin that bitcoin will be just bitcoin. Bitcoin and see.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#19

Post by milesf »

mmanfrin wrote: post #17
unabridged wrote: post #14

Bitcoin is still in beta, new features can always be added. They are building something to last the rest of the century at least, so its going slow. Plus even without adding anything, bitcoin -> monero -> bitcoin solves the privacy problem.

Bitcoin is still in beta W h a t.

What's so surprising about that? All cryptocurrencies are still very experimental. Nothing shocking about that.

Re: The Bitcoin Flaw: Monero Rising

#20

Post by simplify »

badloginagain wrote: post #16

> How would you feel if you were required to print, in legible block letters, your full name on every dollar bill before you spent it? I already do this with 99% of my purchases. I almost solely purchase through credit card, which is a contractual obligation that my clearly identified person will allow a financial institution to pay for this coffee on my behalf, on promise I will pay that institution back at a later…

Not entirely equivalent, since the coffee shop does not receive your purchase history.
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