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A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

nytimes.com

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Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#101

Post by aacook »

mikeokner wrote: post #99
andygcook wrote: post #36

Elder loneliness is something I think about a lot. My grandparents on my father’s side are both 94. They’re also both hard of hearing. My grandpa had scarlett fever as a child and went almost deaf. He struggled through school and eventually got hearing aids in his 20’s. A huge improvement for him and every time he recounts that story he revels at the wonders of technology. I like to think my love of tech just runs in…

This is one of the best ideas (and execution) I've seen in a while! Great example of solving a problem w/ technology and turning it into a business.

Thank you. Means a lot.

It's been the most interesting journey I've had to date. Unsure of where it'll lead but I plan to push through the end of December. I've been at it essentially full-time since the beginning of September with help from Andy on nights/weekends.

Prior to this project, I had a failed solo side project. This project is different in so many ways, in part because I have people to talk to. For example, my friend Josh has been incredibly helpful on the product design side, talking on the phone with me once a week. And of course Andy, a world-class brother who I love.

We need to reach something like 2,000 Nanas to make this a full-time focus (for me) and I think we have a shot. But if even if we don't get there, the amount of happiness generated in the world from just the first 7 deliveries outweighs the sum of all other happiness generated for everything I've worked on to date. Next week 23 more orders are being delivered and it'll be awesome fuel. Even though I'm being a bit irresponsible bootstrapping this project through to the end of December, I'll have zero regrets if we don't end up getting to 2k.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#102

Post by chesimov »

nickthemagicman wrote: post #69
chesimov wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever spoken to somebody who actually lived under a different system? You will not like what they tell you.

I love capitalism. Unregulated capitalism like in America is a dystopic nightmare for many people.

Maybe the Northern European approaches are a little kinder to the human condition?

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#103

Post by krapp »

nickthemagicman wrote: post #69
chesimov wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever spoken to somebody who actually lived under a different system? You will not like what they tell you.

I love capitalism. Unregulated capitalism like in America is a dystopic nightmare for many people.

American capitalism is regulated. Not as regulated as other capitalist systems, but calling it "unregulated" is simply incorrect.

And capitalism in Japan isn't the same flavor of capitalism in the US, and wouldn't necessarily have the same societal weight in context.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#104

Post by icebraining »

ThrowawayR2 wrote: post #71
icebraining wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's like, your opinion, man. Not everyone agrees that our existence even has a purpose.

It's the opinion of the ancestors of every currently living thing on this planet, going back to the first organisms to have evolved. Any of them who thought otherwise is extinct because they failed to pass on their genes. The future literally belongs to those who agree with the grandparent poster.

Nope. You can have children for many reasons besides thinking that's the purpose of our existence. The future doesn't care why you have children.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#105

Post by chr1 »

Fnoord wrote: post #76
yodsanklai wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> having a child is for the parents, not the child Of course it's for the parents. You can't make a child "for the child", since it doesn't exist (and doesn't care) until you gave life to it. I don't have kids, and I've been told on several occasions that I was selfish for not doing so. Isn't it more selfish to have kids (who didn't ask for being born) for one's own joy?

> I don't have kids, and I've been told on several occasions that I was selfish for not doing so. Isn't it more selfish to have kids (who didn't ask for being born) for one's own joy? There's a lot of positive things you can do for the environment: less or no (air, car) travel, avoid plastic and downcycling your waste, avoiding meat. As our population size increases the one best thing you can do for the environment i…

That's a terrible thing to do for the environment, 3bln people can ruin it just as easily as 7bln (maybe a little bit slower).

But having less people, especially in rich parts of the world, means they won't be able to develop technology to control the climate and, travel to other planets, and do all the other awesome things people do.

Besides whats the point of saving the environment if there are no people to enjoy it.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#106

Post by chr1 »

croon wrote: post #22
adrianN wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how many of the young people you connected with that way would come to sit by your side at your deathbed.

I promise, that if you put the same work into being there for someone as you _HAVE_ to do with your own kids, and do it because you want to connect, that someone will be there. If you half-ass it for the wrong reasons, of course not. But the same thing is true, but with higher costs (both economical and psychological), if you have your own child with the same attitude.

It is hard to do the same work for someone else, because they don't need you as much as your child would, and they won't be near you as much.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#107

Post by fallingfrog »

crispyambulance wrote: post #74
fallingfrog wrote: post #24

I think I tend towards the Aubrey de Grey point of view on this- it's not necessarily anything anyone is doing wrong here, it's more that these folks are living in dying bodies that can't do what they want them to do. If they were suddenly young again- they could go out, make new connections, start over. With that said, I do see the point that this is a western/capitalist phenomenon in the sense that capitalism encou…

Folks following the Aubrey de Grey line of thought separate "the person" and "their body" as though the person exists as some kind of "software" running in "hardware" that is about to fail. It might not be that simple. Being suddenly young again would certainly be delightful for a while but there's a huge psychological burden that comes with living for a long time. While it may be possible to extend the life of the b…

Well, I don't know about a huge psychological burden- older people have been shown to have better coping mechanisms than young people.

There might be some wider problems of overpopulation though, and longer lifespan might also cause increased income inequality. That's a separate question though.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#108

Post by bartedinburgh »

jlj wrote: post #87
fallingfrog wrote: post #24

I think I tend towards the Aubrey de Grey point of view on this- it's not necessarily anything anyone is doing wrong here, it's more that these folks are living in dying bodies that can't do what they want them to do. If they were suddenly young again- they could go out, make new connections, start over. With that said, I do see the point that this is a western/capitalist phenomenon in the sense that capitalism encou…

No one ever says "I wished I worked more" from their deathbed. Prioritizing money and status ahead of family and friends is a personal decision. Business and personal success can coexist in capitalism but many people choose the former over the latter and assume they are mutually exclusive. I made that choice out of college and it took me until my mid 30's to realize it. It's really hard to re-learn how to go the othe…

Except those who die in poverty after a miserable retirement because they haven't prioritized financial wellbeing in their lives.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#109

Post by Fnoord »

chr1 wrote: post #105
Fnoord wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't have kids, and I've been told on several occasions that I was selfish for not doing so. Isn't it more selfish to have kids (who didn't ask for being born) for one's own joy? There's a lot of positive things you can do for the environment: less or no (air, car) travel, avoid plastic and downcycling your waste, avoiding meat. As our population size increases the one best thing you can do for the environment i…

That's a terrible thing to do for the environment, 3bln people can ruin it just as easily as 7bln (maybe a little bit slower). But having less people, especially in rich parts of the world, means they won't be able to develop technology to control the climate and, travel to other planets, and do all the other awesome things people do. Besides whats the point of saving the environment if there are no people to enjoy i…

> That's a terrible thing to do for the environment, 3bln people can ruin it just as easily as 7bln (maybe a little bit slower).

Sure, and one crazy narcissistic politician can also destroy Earth. That's not the point; the point is that on average, a child is going to have an average meaningful impact, and we cannot sustain the projected growth if we keep going on like we are right now. For example, those rich people you're so enthusiastic about are eating a lot of cow meat which has a terrible Co2 footprint.

> (maybe a little bit slower).

That's a good thing. If we're slower we'll be able to have more advanced technology.

Its extremely arrogant to believe that your rich kid is going to make the difference in the world. Statistically, it won't.

> Besides whats the point of saving the environment if there are no people to enjoy it.

If you decide to not procreate there will still be people to live on Earth.

If we destroy Earth for human inhabitation that doesn't equal all life is extinct.

Re: A Generation in Japan Is Facing a Lonely Death

#110

Post by JBlue42 »

icc97 wrote: post #89
skadamou wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly is the butterfly generation? I have never heard this term before. Are you referring to the book "The Butterfly Generation" by Palash Krishna Mehrotra and if so does this term have a distinctly Indian meaning or does it apply to people from other countries as well? Thanks for satisfying my curiosity! https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13432312-the-butterfly-g...

The butterfly generation term that I knew was from when I started work in London around 2000. [0] > 'Engaging the Butterfly Generation', the generation of kids that just won't settle, anywhere! I took it to indicate a generation of teenagers / university graduates that grew up being able to use the benefits of globalisation and to flit from one job or country to the next with ease. [0]: http://www.c21media.net/confer…

I did that throughout my early 20s. I'm still in regular contact with people I met 14-15 years ago. It takes effort for regular stuff. The only reason I keep my Facebook around is because it's a glorified address book and I'll hear from some of the folks from my past travels on there around holidays and birthdays. It's about the same as I talk to cousins and aunts/uncles.

My core group of friends is in touch all the time. About 12 people since 2001. I don't talk with anyone from high school (pre-01).

It just depends on your level of effort. I think for American kids, it's definitely worth getting out into the world and seeing a different perspective. It can only improve our country when we get outside the rhetoric/news bubble and see how things are done, for better or worse, in the rest of the world.

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