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The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

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Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#31
post #27
post #3

PSA: It's about this "KVM": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KVM_switch Not this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel-based_Virtual_Machine

... which makes this a total non-story in my opinion :) Of course KVM switches will eventually disappear; when was the last time any of us (minus datacenter staff) has been to the server room since the dawn of the PaaS age?

I wouldn't think they are common in data centers either with all the good OOB management tools now available.

Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#33
post #25

KVM switches used to be a huge and super important (and expensive) thing in rack server farms back when every rack or every few racks had a pull-out tray with a keyboard and a monitor. Technology moved on. First the tray and monitor disappeared with KVM-over-IP, which saved many trips to the server room. Then the KVM switches themselves disappeared, as manufacturers integrated out-of-band remote access into the serve…

As well the use of KVMs by PC enthusiasts has most likely been replaced by virtual machines.

Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#34
post #25

KVM switches used to be a huge and super important (and expensive) thing in rack server farms back when every rack or every few racks had a pull-out tray with a keyboard and a monitor. Technology moved on. First the tray and monitor disappeared with KVM-over-IP, which saved many trips to the server room. Then the KVM switches themselves disappeared, as manufacturers integrated out-of-band remote access into the serve…

Yes, no doubt that rack-based kvm stuff disappeared. It was awful: hard to rig, hard to use with confidence.

(Confidence? "Wait, wait, am I talking to data2 or web4 or what?)

KVM was a just-barely-competent solution to a hair-on-fire (=== must-solve-now) problem.

Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#35
I think it's a two pronged demise

* Current display (DP, HDMP) and peripheral(USB) technology is complex, and probably is going to be expensive to switch in the fly without being unreliable.

* Virtual Machines and Remote Desktop solutions are good enough. Sure they can be a bit laggy sometimes, but good enough for most tasks.

So i guess that KVM switches are going to be more expensive to make, and there are less customers who really need them...

Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#36
post #9

The main thing that has pissed me off with technologies like DisplayPort and HDMI is that I cannot actually turn my monitors off when I'm not using my computer. With DVI I could turn the monitors off and the desktop and applications would stay where they were. With HDMI/Displayport it considers the monitor disconnected, hence re-adjusts the desktop and moves everything around. I would love an option that I could swit…

There are two possibilities:

1. Fake GPU software, which I haven't researched at all but probably exists

2. Forcing your graphics chipset to turn a specific head on and leave it on

Here's a Linux-specific example of how to do #2. Since I'm just talking to graphics hardware here, there should be equivalent operations for all of the following for other operating systems.

I don't connect an external display at any point.

First of all, how things look to begin with:

  $ xrandr   
  Screen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 1024 x 768, maximum 4096 x 4096
  VGA-0 disconnected (normal left inverted right x axis y axis)
  DVI-0 disconnected (normal left inverted right x axis y axis)
  LVDS connected 1024x768+0+0 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 0mm x 0mm
     1024x768      60.00*+
     800x600       59.86  
     848x480       59.66  
     720x480       59.71  
     640x480       59.38  
Now, `xrandr --output VGA-0 --auto` isn't going to do anything because --auto will tell the GPU to pick the best resolution. No screen is attached so there's no list of resolutions to pick from.

So, I'll generate a generic CVT modeline that sets up the VGA output for 1024x768@60Hz.

  $ cvt 1024 768 60
  # 1024x768 59.92 Hz (CVT 0.79M3) hsync: 47.82 kHz; pclk: 63.50 MHz
  Modeline "1024x768_60.00"   63.50  1024 1072 1176 1328  768 771 775 798 -hsync +
Cool. Now I'll tell X11 about the modeline (note the copy-paste):

  $ xrandr --newmode  "1024x768_60.00"   63.50  1024 1072 1176 1328  768 771 775 798 -hsync +
...And now do the XRandR dance to actually tell the output about the right modeline (this is Xorg-bureaucracy-specific):

  $ xrandr --addmode VGA-0 "1024x768_60.00"
Let's review the xrandr output:

  $ xrandr
  Screen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 1024 x 768, maximum 4096 x 4096
  VGA-0 disconnected (normal left inverted right x axis y axis)
     1024x768_60.00  59.92  
  (...)
At this point I can go ahead and

  $ xrandr --output VGA-0 --mode "1024x768_60.00"
and my screen displays garbage for a fraction of a second and then figures itself out.

At this point I know the output is enabled (and the glitch didn't mean nothing) and in mirroring mode. I can prove this without a display attached by running xrandr again:

  $ xrandr
  Screen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 1024 x 768, maximum 4096 x 4096
  VGA-0 disconnected 1024x768+0+0 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 0mm x 0mm
     1024x768_60.00  59.92* 
  (...)
Two things: one, the mode has an asterisk next to it, meaning it's active (albeit without a screen attached), and two (the following will make sense in a minute if it doesn't straight away) Screen 0 has a "current" size of 1024x768. (Xorg "screens" represent a collection of video outputs you can move windows between.)

So, let's disable mirroring mode and make this new Schrödinger-pseudo-existent area its own independent surface.

  $ xrandr --output VGA-0 --left-of LVDS
At this point, i3 (my windowmanager) decides to move every single window onto the new offscreen surface area, and I go blind. Isn't minimalist software wonderful? (A new windowmanager is on my todo list; i3 drives me nuts. Anyway.)

Once I sort i3 out and get back to a terminal, xrandr shows something new and interesting:

  $ xrandr
  Screen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 2048 x 768, maximum 4096 x 4096
  (...)
Oh hey, the Screen size is now 2048x768! Proof that I have two 1024x... outputs configured side-by-side. If I wanted to I could do --above or --below and have a 1024x1536 display.

Here's the technical moral of the story: since approximately the time of the dinosaurs monitors have used EDID to provide autodetection info to graphics chipsets, so forcing manual configuration is pretty deeply buried.

But that's what you need to do; "my screen is weird and needs a custom configuration" and "okay just set these parameters and leave the output head running" are analogous.

If you want to turn your screen off and have the GPU keep the head running, I recommend figuring out how to fish out the modeline your GPU is currently using, and then force the GPU to manually use that modeline. That should disable output autodetection and keep the output permanently active.

Despite the fact that I've demoed Linux output configuration here, you're (ironically) not too likely to have this problem on Linux as Xorg is fairly flexible, and wouldn't normally need these kinds of instructions provided to it under normal circumstances; for Linux it would be more "what's explicitly killing the output and how do I turn it off" as opposed to digging around in driver settings.

Also - I picked VGA for this example, honestly probably for nostalgic reasons. These instructions will work equivalently regardless of output type.

Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#37
post #17
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You must have some dodgy hardware. This is definitely not normal, at least with HDMI. I just tried it with the monitor right in front of me, even unplugging it from the wall didn't cause the laptop to drop the monitor like it would if I had disconnected the HDMI cable.

Sounds perfectly normal to me. I’ve only ever seen the behavior daemin describes.

See my reply to the subthread commentor.

Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#38

I use this one for my 40" 4k monitor, and it works great : https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01BSNSOPU/

Oh boy, the price! The article is lamenting the expense of 'modern' KVM switches.

For reference, a switch with 'legacy' USB 2.0/VGA connectors that powers my ageing home PCs is this model:

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/All-in-one-Mini-2-Ports-KVM-Manu...

Re: The Peculiarly Quiet Decline and Fall of the KVM

#40
I replaced them with standalone USB & HDMI switches. I connect 5 PCs on my desk (main PC, Deep Learning rig, NAS, 2x NUC) first to two 4-port USB switches, then have one 2-port switch that switches between these two 4-port switches, and then a large HDMI switch. It works fine; each of those switches was <$5.
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