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Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

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Re: Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

#51

Post by jblow »

subwayclub wrote: post #45
jblow wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How popular is your online game? P.S. Someone the other day asked why I don’t post much to HN (and don’t put much effort in when I do). This kind of junk is exactly why!

It was reasonably popular and got picked up by a publisher and perhaps you have played it, but I won't talk about that. The problem with your original assertion is that you have ignored the virtual world player types as described by Richard Bartle and positioned the Achiever view as the sole one of import, subsequently question begging your way to a narrow conclusion about what quality is. I will explain further but…

I don’t think the Bartle stuff is useful in terms of concrete game design, the main weapon in my online game (from the 1990s!) was hitscan and not slow-moving projectiles as you assert (so I don’t think you know what you are talking about there), and the whole tone of your reply is personally hostile while asserting really weird things, so I don’t see anything else meaningful worth replying to, sorry.

Re: Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

#52

Post by koffiezet »

Hurtak wrote: post #13

It is a 17-year-old article. Did the fundamentals stayed the same or has there been any significant paradigm shifts in how game networking is done?

If anything, things have become less complex. Nowadays, you get higher update rates, so good prediction becomes less critical - and things get simplified a lot. A lot of the complexity of the network/game engine code in Q2/Q3 and derivative games (like Warsow) was dedicated to network prediction.

Re: Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

#53

Post by kernel_sanders »

ggambetta wrote: post #44
rjeli wrote: post #12

Here’s a nice white paper from Valve with diagrams on lag compensation, prediction, authoritative server, etc: https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Source_Multiplayer_...

I've made an interactive demo that lets you tweak the different knobs and see what happens: http://www.gabrielgambetta.com/client-side-prediction-live-d...

I made my own simple multiplayer 2d game to understand this stuff and just want to let you know that your site was invaluable to understanding client side prediction and server side reconciliation! Thanks so much for that!

Re: Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

#54

Post by juliangoldsmith »

alkonaut wrote: post #46
dandr01d wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. I hate how online matchmaking these days has made away with the community feel that picking your own server provided.

I still play a short list of favorite servers in BF4. This is a game from just a couple of years ago. Are you saying some newer games only have random matchmaking and no joining a favorite server?

Most new games I've seen have only random matchmaking, unfortunately. Even Quake Champions.

Re: Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

#55

Post by mrguyorama »

dandr01d wrote: post #10
roflchoppa wrote: post #9

> "The days of needing to do such things as manually type in IP addresses to connect to remote servers are coming rapidly to a close. Therefore, it is important for you to provide a seamless user experience for your gamers as they go on-line." >> I miss the days of playing CS-1.5 and having to use gametiger.com to find servers to play in. Lots of pool_day and de_dats.

Yup. I hate how online matchmaking these days has made away with the community feel that picking your own server provided.

Another downside of current gen matchmaking is just how SHORT games are. Back when I played Halo 1 pc's multiplayer, you could watch a single Blood Gulch CTF game go on for an entire WEEK before one team got the 7 captures required to win on that server. It created a really interesting dynamic where attempts at the flag were each unique events, requiring planning, preparation, camaraderie and teamwork in a game without voice chat. You could leave a server to go to bed, and wake up the next day, hopping back on and see the same people on the same teams still going at it. It was much more IRC-like in feeling

People built communities by just being on the same server often. Friendships were made, guilds too. But now all you have is 12 other little kids all free-for-alling shotguns for a brief 5 minute instant gratification fest

Re: Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

#56

Post by therealdrag0 »

dandr01d wrote: post #10
roflchoppa wrote: post #9

> "The days of needing to do such things as manually type in IP addresses to connect to remote servers are coming rapidly to a close. Therefore, it is important for you to provide a seamless user experience for your gamers as they go on-line." >> I miss the days of playing CS-1.5 and having to use gametiger.com to find servers to play in. Lots of pool_day and de_dats.

Yup. I hate how online matchmaking these days has made away with the community feel that picking your own server provided.

Games like League of Legends support custom games, but I don't get the impression that they are used much and I don't know if there are persistent servers there, so you don't get to go hangout with the same gang/community at will.

Re: Half-Life and Team Fortress Networking

#57

Post by ionstraub »

mrguyorama wrote: post #55
dandr01d wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. I hate how online matchmaking these days has made away with the community feel that picking your own server provided.

Another downside of current gen matchmaking is just how SHORT games are. Back when I played Halo 1 pc's multiplayer, you could watch a single Blood Gulch CTF game go on for an entire WEEK before one team got the 7 captures required to win on that server. It created a really interesting dynamic where attempts at the flag were each unique events, requiring planning, preparation, camaraderie and teamwork in a game witho…

I can totally agree. There's no way to go on the same server a few times a week and form friendships. Now you have to in many games specifically add someone as a friend and wait for them to confirm it, if you ever want to see that person again. But that's not organic and that's not how friendships develop. I can't make friends on Overwatch, for example. I wish more people would talk about how this has been totally stripped from online games nowadays. People don't even bother talking during matches, mostly because as you mention they are so short.
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