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Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

foreignpolicy.com

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Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#91

Post by matte_black »

jondubois wrote: post #84
b0rsuk wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm afraid it won't work well without extra regulation laws. Even if Facebook is broken, it has shown the way. Before, it was MySpace (although it was never so popular). If someone breaks FB, the strongest competitor living in its shadow will step up. I think it is the nature of certain services to centralize. Search engines, social networks. Unless someone forces them to inter-operate, it's winner takes all.

The US government should take possession of all Facebook shares and use the profits to fund universal basic income. I don't think anyone would complain... Except a tiny percent of the population who owned Facebook shares but who cares, they're evil/morally bankrupt anyway.

You realize for them to make any profit off of “shares” they’d have to sell them back to someone willing to buy them...

That’s aside from the fact that whole idea is ridiculous to begin with.

Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#94

Post by barrkel »

saas_co_de wrote: post #65
beautifulfreak wrote: post #49

>Facebook can no longer deny its moral responsibility to try to understand how cyberspace, law, and politics collide in each of the countries where it operates, nor its responsibility to do something about it. That sentence doesn't make sense. Do something about what? How those things collide? It's very unclear what the author thinks Facebook is supposed to do, or what he thinks Facebook is actually responsible for.…

Yes, it is interesting that the author sees no place in the modern world for the kind of free speech enshrined in the U.S. Constitution. They are happy with a giant global monopolist controlling all speech, as long as they use that power to enforce their political agenda. That is an incredibly dangerous mindset and one that seems to be becoming more pervasive in respectable circles.

Free speech is a dangerous idea by itself, and without democracy and solid institutions, it can easily be the tool of populists and demagogues. It's not an absolute value all on its own.

Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#95

Post by hkmurakami »

saas_co_de wrote: post #65
beautifulfreak wrote: post #49

>Facebook can no longer deny its moral responsibility to try to understand how cyberspace, law, and politics collide in each of the countries where it operates, nor its responsibility to do something about it. That sentence doesn't make sense. Do something about what? How those things collide? It's very unclear what the author thinks Facebook is supposed to do, or what he thinks Facebook is actually responsible for.…

Yes, it is interesting that the author sees no place in the modern world for the kind of free speech enshrined in the U.S. Constitution. They are happy with a giant global monopolist controlling all speech, as long as they use that power to enforce their political agenda. That is an incredibly dangerous mindset and one that seems to be becoming more pervasive in respectable circles.

Ideals over first principles seems to be their MO

Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#96

Post by platz »

beautifulfreak wrote: post #49

>Facebook can no longer deny its moral responsibility to try to understand how cyberspace, law, and politics collide in each of the countries where it operates, nor its responsibility to do something about it. That sentence doesn't make sense. Do something about what? How those things collide? It's very unclear what the author thinks Facebook is supposed to do, or what he thinks Facebook is actually responsible for.…

The solution to big problems that Facebook creates should not be to give Facebook more power or authority (to ostensibly try to correct those issues).

We need to start reclaiming power from facebook, not abdicating more to it.

Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#97

Post by spunker540 »

bshimmin wrote: post #52
knolan wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also true for a lot of older people new to the internet. My mother doesn’t understand that her laptop can do more than browse Facebook and buy things on Amazon. Her bookmarks are the random pages of her friends. Her primary source of news is fast becoming whatever click bait she sees there. I tell her not to trust Facebook, I explain how she is their product and they exploit her but she doesn’t listen.

I can see a few problems with this. The concept of "you are their product" is not an easy one to understand if people don't have any relevant background or experience in thinking critically about the problem. It requires thinking through several non-obvious layers: for example, it's easy for people to get stuck at "yes, I don't pay for Facebook, that's why it has advertising" without making the leap to "most business…

The “Facebook sells your data” myth is too often rehashed. Facebook has done studies and actually found that your personal info is not all that valuable in and of itself. Your likes, statuses, friends and photos do not provide meaningful targeting data. (Age and geography are meaningful, but those are already available with traditional media). Facebook’s huge money maker is its ability to let other companies target their own customers on the Facebook platform.

If Nordstrom keeps track of its website customers and what products they look at, and can then target those same users directly on Facebook with related products, they’re willing to pay way more for that kind of targeting than they are “women in their 40s who ‘like’ shopping”. Facebook supports both, but facebooks real success comes from letting companies leverage their own data on the Facebook platform.

That and the fact that they have a billion users log in per day. If any other site had that kind of traffic they’d be killing it regardless of the personal data they possessed.

Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#98

Post by dasil003 »

I have no love for Facebook, but it's important to recognize that Facebook role in these problems is only incidental. If there was no Facebook, we'd have the same growing fake news, astroturfing and bot problem—these are inherent to social media and widespread internet access. I'm not against regulation of Facebook per se, but the broader question of how we contend with online misinformation and propaganda in an online world is much more important.

Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#99

Post by InternetOfStuff »

saas_co_de wrote: post #65
beautifulfreak wrote: post #49

>Facebook can no longer deny its moral responsibility to try to understand how cyberspace, law, and politics collide in each of the countries where it operates, nor its responsibility to do something about it. That sentence doesn't make sense. Do something about what? How those things collide? It's very unclear what the author thinks Facebook is supposed to do, or what he thinks Facebook is actually responsible for.…

Yes, it is interesting that the author sees no place in the modern world for the kind of free speech enshrined in the U.S. Constitution. They are happy with a giant global monopolist controlling all speech, as long as they use that power to enforce their political agenda. That is an incredibly dangerous mindset and one that seems to be becoming more pervasive in respectable circles.

> Yes, it is interesting that the author sees no place in the modern world for the kind of free speech enshrined in the U.S. Constitution.

Well, there is such a place. The U.S.

However, in Germany, German rules of speech apply. As a German, I consider this a good thing. And remember, the German constitution was written at the pleasure of the allies -- the US were apparently quite happy with the way our constitution balances freedom and responsibility.

And, corner cases aside, so am I. I prefer "responsible speech" to the US "wild west speech". This is largely cultural I'm sure.

Of course once we accept that Germany can insist on their own model of speech, so can China. Or Syria. Or Thailand. Which I find hardly ideal, given that I'd like to propagate liberal (and, dare I say it, "western") values. But I don't have a decent solution to this conundrum.

Re: Facebook Can’t Cope with the World It’s Created

#100

Post by BurritoAlPastor »

saas_co_de wrote: post #65
beautifulfreak wrote: post #49

>Facebook can no longer deny its moral responsibility to try to understand how cyberspace, law, and politics collide in each of the countries where it operates, nor its responsibility to do something about it. That sentence doesn't make sense. Do something about what? How those things collide? It's very unclear what the author thinks Facebook is supposed to do, or what he thinks Facebook is actually responsible for.…

Yes, it is interesting that the author sees no place in the modern world for the kind of free speech enshrined in the U.S. Constitution. They are happy with a giant global monopolist controlling all speech, as long as they use that power to enforce their political agenda. That is an incredibly dangerous mindset and one that seems to be becoming more pervasive in respectable circles.

The Constitutional guarantee of free speech mandates the behavior of the government to not interfere with the rights of private actors. When a private actor (such as Facebook) chooses to publish or suppress content from a third party, that is a voluntary exercise of Constitutionally protected speech.

Social media services have neither a moral nor legal obligation to publish hate speech.

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