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A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

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Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#361

Post by golemotron »

clord wrote: post #112

We did this. My wife has a masters in microbio, and I worked at IBM on their C++ and for Fortran compilers for about 8 years (yay std::atomics). I still do remote contract work to help pay for upgrades to the farm. Would be nice to get one of my side-projects finished and start pumping out some income streams, but it's not a big rush anymore. I have a point of sale system built with React and Haskell that integrates…

> but honestly my bills are paid and I don't feel the need to make more money than I do right now. Why take on the stress?

What is the retirement plan for a farmer?

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#362

Post by pavel_lishin »

erikpukinskis wrote: post #345
pavel_lishin wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I like working from home and having no childcare expenses. I worry that with a young child, we'd still have childcare expenses - except that instead of paying with money, we'd be paying with our time. My wife and I discovered, like many parents probably do, that raising a child is fucking hard. We love her, we wouldn't trade her for the world, and it's fun, but it's the kind of fun you have while camping, or hiking…

You’re doing a specific high intensity form of childcare. There are lower intensity approaches. When full time child care was the norm, parents didn’t fuss over their kids. “Is she dying or soaking in shit/piss? Ok, then she’s fine for an hour”

But even with a minimal approach, I still wouldn't be able to work from home with any level of effectiveness, because at some point she would be soaked in shit and piss, or would need something, or would be about to injure herself. Kids need some minimal amount of supervision below a certain age.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#363

Post by spraak »

JPKab wrote: post #243
clord wrote: post #112

We did this. My wife has a masters in microbio, and I worked at IBM on their C++ and for Fortran compilers for about 8 years (yay std::atomics). I still do remote contract work to help pay for upgrades to the farm. Would be nice to get one of my side-projects finished and start pumping out some income streams, but it's not a big rush anymore. I have a point of sale system built with React and Haskell that integrates…

I grew up in a rural community where farming was basically the only industry. It's easy to talk about how awesome it is when you basically are selling insanely overpriced boutique goods (organic, free-range, etc) to yuppies who are willing to pay triple for their calories. Once enough people do this, the prices fall and you're just another farmer, scraping by. I grew up working on farms. It's not romantic to me in an…

> they have no idea what agriculture really involves

Well, no. They have no idea what it involves for that type of scale, but to say they have no idea at all (about their operating scale) seems to just show your hurt feelings about growing up that way.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#364

Post by cvsh »

clord wrote: post #112

We did this. My wife has a masters in microbio, and I worked at IBM on their C++ and for Fortran compilers for about 8 years (yay std::atomics). I still do remote contract work to help pay for upgrades to the farm. Would be nice to get one of my side-projects finished and start pumping out some income streams, but it's not a big rush anymore. I have a point of sale system built with React and Haskell that integrates…

So you started in 2011-2012. What happens when the next downturn comes and people stop buying "expensive pasture fed eggs etc"?

This is my fear about doing something like this. Boutique farming seems like it would similar to the oil industry in how especially sensitive it is to economic cyclicality. Having spent the past 5+ years farming surely complicates the process of getting a job in tech during a contraction.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#365

Post by ianai »

roel_v wrote: post #348
pajaroide wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I did it someday I wouldn't be thinking about making money, just being self-sufficient and growing enough food for me and my family. If I could sell some that's great but that's not the objective.

Where will you get clothing, gas, spare parts, school supplies, internet/phone connection, healthcare? There's more to self-sufficiency than eating.

My guess would be to be independently wealthy at that point.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#366

Post by rmrm »

discreteevent wrote: post #349
erikpukinskis wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chickens are pretty easy though. You can pay some neighborhood teenagers to take care of the flock while you’re in Aruba.

We had about 20 chickens and this is exactly what we did. Not sure why you got downvoted.

Talking about farmscale agriculture, it's hundreds of chickens at least. If it's pastured, they likely need to be moved quite often.

Chickens are likely easiest, but on a scale to produce a living for a family, I don't think any type of farming or ranching is low effort or easy to step away from.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#367

Post by ianai »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #362
erikpukinskis wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re doing a specific high intensity form of childcare. There are lower intensity approaches. When full time child care was the norm, parents didn’t fuss over their kids. “Is she dying or soaking in shit/piss? Ok, then she’s fine for an hour”

But even with a minimal approach, I still wouldn't be able to work from home with any level of effectiveness, because at some point she would be soaked in shit and piss, or would need something, or would be about to injure herself. Kids need some minimal amount of supervision below a certain age.

None of this would really be a problem if the economic system actually worked. If people actually made enough to afford FT care of their children and home stay for the very early years then the economy would seriously employ many more people. But instead people have to essentially win the economic lottery.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#368

Post by FussyZeus »

naavis wrote: post #347
erikpukinskis wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Once enough people do this, the prices fall and you're just another farmer, scraping by. You’re assuming that the bulk of the market always has to be cheap commodity goods. But the idea behind the artisanal movement is that both sides of the market will change. More small producers will produce more high quality goods and more consumers will pay high prices to buy them. Both sides need to grow in synchrony. Maybe y…

There is a huge number of people who can barely afford to buy cheap food now, let alone expensive "artisanal" food.

There's also a huge number of people (myself included) who can afford (and do afford) to buy expensive quality stuff.

I don't hold it against science and bio-tech for bringing high yield and disease resistant crops to market; that shit will help us feed the whole planet economically. Doesn't mean I can't also enjoy organic, non-altered food in my own home. I get annoyed with this attitude so many people have about these things, that somehow we can either feed the whole planet economically or have ritzy well-to-do people buy organic kale. We can do both very easily.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#369

Post by mygo »

naavis wrote: post #347
erikpukinskis wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Once enough people do this, the prices fall and you're just another farmer, scraping by. You’re assuming that the bulk of the market always has to be cheap commodity goods. But the idea behind the artisanal movement is that both sides of the market will change. More small producers will produce more high quality goods and more consumers will pay high prices to buy them. Both sides need to grow in synchrony. Maybe y…

There is a huge number of people who can barely afford to buy cheap food now, let alone expensive "artisanal" food.

There is a huge number of people who can barely afford to buy cheap laptops now, let alone expensive MacBooks.

Doesn’t change the fact that Apple is the most profitable firm.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#370

Post by pdfernhout »

Pica_soO wrote: post #355
userbinator wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up working on farms. It's not romantic to me in any way. Being outside is nice, but there's a reason the kids doing this grew up in suburbs and cities: they have no idea what agriculture really involves when you have to achieve economies of scale to make it remotely profitable. I suspect it's a "the grass is always greener in the neighbour's lawn... or in this case pasture" effect.

Beeing outside for long stretches might sound healthy, but at the end of day gives you skin-cancer. Source of Information: Scar over my eye, where the doctor cut out the summers harvest of pesticide resistant weeds in uv-rays.

Skin cancer is generally much easier to treat though than all the other internal cancers people can get from vitamin D deficiency... Also, something to think about: http://dermatologytimes.modernmedicine.com/dermatology-times... "Researchers at the Queensland Institute of Medical Research (QIMR) have revealed that they are finding more instances of melanoma in office workers than people who work outdoors..."
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