Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

medium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

271–280 of 321 posts

Re: I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

#271

Post by loblollyboy »

aphextron wrote: post #150
jameskegel wrote: post #11

I read the article; I'm not sure this is so much a criticism of the industry as it is an examination of this developer's personal anecdotal experience. As developers, we lead a very charmed life that others sometimes aren't even born with the chance to intellectually compete for; the author neglects to address how lucky we are to be able to do this at all, let alone to then find employment in it. If it's not an indus…

This one hits hard. As a front end developer, when people ask what I do, I say "I make buttons". Red buttons, blue buttons, big buttons, small buttons. Any kind of button you can imagine. I spend my life making buttons light up on a colorful screen. And then people click on those buttons and I get paid an obscene amount of money for it. I'm not sure if this is how people are supposed to live. It's driving me mad. But…

I’m a pretty good dev not getting paid enough - where do you work?

Re: I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

#272

Post by axedwool »

noncoml wrote: post #257
aphextron wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This one hits hard. As a front end developer, when people ask what I do, I say "I make buttons". Red buttons, blue buttons, big buttons, small buttons. Any kind of button you can imagine. I spend my life making buttons light up on a colorful screen. And then people click on those buttons and I get paid an obscene amount of money for it. I'm not sure if this is how people are supposed to live. It's driving me mad. But…

This hit a nerve. I think I hate my life as a developer, but then I see this janitor, in our office, cleaning the floor and windows, cleaning and unblocking the toilets, etc., and is always greeting me with a smile. Makes me wonder why I deserve to be living such s luxurious life, while this guy has to spend his days waking up probably around 5am, commuting for a hour just to clean somebody else’s shit just to earn 1…

I think a janitor has some advantages going for him which are pretty rare in our thing, as well as fewer issues overall.

For example, the janitor probably has concrete and relatively unchanging definitions of success in his work. His job has tangible effects every day on those he provides his service to. There aren't many janitorial meetings. He probably doesn't have to massage the ego of his boss. To my knowledge, there are no Sanitation Reviews where some coworker will criticize him for not following the One True Sanitation Style or the latest fad in Toilet Driven Development. His profession is not constantly put in the critical spotlight by the media as a front line in the culture wars. There's no such phrase as "janitor bro" which people use to stereotype and demean them.

Focusing just on "I make $X, they make $X/4, how can I complain" downplays a lot of conditions which can make some people in this line of work very bitter about it.

Re: I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

#273

Post by throwawayy60 »

This really hit home for me, and I personally know plenty of other dissatisfied software developers who would feel the same. It’s incredibly sad. And this doesn’t even take into account the problems female developers run into.

The biggest thing for me was the hours. I can’t stand “startup hours”. In my first three years of software development, I guess I lucked out because this wasn’t a problem. But after my first two jobs, I started taking in 9:30-6:30 and 10-7. When I interviewed elsewhere, I came across a new term. I was told “we work startup hours.” Some companies described it using different words, but the meaning was always the same. You’ll be here late, just like everybody else. If you don’t like it, don’t work here.

I got that from three out of the four companies I interviewed for. Not a huge sample size, but hugely demoralizing.

I became a consultant thinking billable hours might save me. It’s not perfect but it’s a hell of a lot better. Working long hours is no longer the norm, as it’s cinsidered “eating hours” and doing free work for clients.

Re: I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

#274

Post by pasquinelli »

jaymzcampbell wrote: post #4

I feel like we as an industry can sometimes forget just how good we have it. Many of my friends do not work in tech, they are low paid, they have stressful jobs with little autonomy, they are not challenged at all and they feel little personal accomplishment in their day today. I appreciate the author alludes to this but having seen friends recently job hunting (outside of tech) I am reminded that even on the worst d…

if you have to work for money, it's important to find a job you enjoy doing. not find a job doing something you enjoy, that's one of the worst things you can do. in my experience, that just turns something you enjoy into another chore.

but finding a job you enjoy doing is important. i spent years as a programmer just feeling sick. programming is something i enjoy, but not a job i enjoy doing, and working that job made me miserable in all the ways you're assigning to non-tech work. now i'm a janitor and i feel like a human being again. it's less money, but it's totally worth it.

trouble is, you need to work a job to know how apt you are for it. but then, to get into most classes of work, you need to spend the money to train yourself, with help from the general public perhaps. maybe you'll get a job, maybe not; maybe it'll be good for you and you for it, maybe not. it seems like a pretty sweet deal for the job creators though-- but i'm straying off-topic.

Re: I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

#275

Post by brightball »

psyc wrote: post #208

I feel the same as the author about software jobs. I love CS, coding, architecture, and UX design more than just about anything. I spend at least 60 hours coding most weeks, and mostly for the love of it. But I dearly hope that I never have to go to work at a company, any company, ever again. I've happily accepted a very minimal standard of living to help ensure that. There are a lot of top comments here already that…

I think there is really something to be said for the simple satisfaction of doing almost the same thing everyday and never having expectations change. You leave your job when you clock out.

Constant deadlines can and will wear on you over time. Pressure to meet those deadlines while solving problems in which the completion time has been guessed and the people setting the deadlines don’t seem to get that creates a lot of stress.

It’s honestly made me want to get into dev management just because I feel like I could to more to help dev teams run smoothly than I can as a single developer.

Re: I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

#277

Post by brailsafe »

wsc981 wrote: post #162
ablomen wrote: post #17

Coming from a country with cushy laws on the side of employees etc (the Netherlands), and as a male, I can say that I can really identify with the opening paragraphs of this piece. When I started as all round IT guy 10 years ago it felt like a dream, getting payed for doing what I was doing anyway. And the first 4 years of turning in to a web developer was fun and challenging. But after a while the shine wears off an…

My dream would be to have a house in a tropical country with a nice big garden and inside the house have a nice office. Inside the office I would work part-time for clients, part-time for myself (on games). Or perhaps only for myself, if my own projects would provide me enough income. Additionally, the garden would be used as a farm. I would divide my time between farming groceries and fruits and work on some apps or…

In only a vaguely related tangent, was it at all challenging to immigrate to the country? I've been thinking about these sorts of possibilities but for the most part there always seems to be some challenging aspect to long-term residence. I'm from Canada, and am thinking about various countries in Europe and the tropics.

Re: I don’t want to be a software developer anymore

#280

Post by wsc981 »

brailsafe wrote: post #277
wsc981 wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My dream would be to have a house in a tropical country with a nice big garden and inside the house have a nice office. Inside the office I would work part-time for clients, part-time for myself (on games). Or perhaps only for myself, if my own projects would provide me enough income. Additionally, the garden would be used as a farm. I would divide my time between farming groceries and fruits and work on some apps or…

In only a vaguely related tangent, was it at all challenging to immigrate to the country? I've been thinking about these sorts of possibilities but for the most part there always seems to be some challenging aspect to long-term residence. I'm from Canada, and am thinking about various countries in Europe and the tropics.

My emigration will happen officially next year. For me there would be several ways to make this emigration work:

- I could get married to my girlfriend, this would give me a marriage visa.

- I can pay for a special type of visa with a certain duration (choices are 5, 10, 20 years). A 5-year visa would cost around 10.000 EUR or 8 EUR / day and gives some extra benefits, like yearly health check-ups at a major hospital, free limousine service near airport, preferred treatment at airport (not wait in long queues), legal help, etc...

- From 50+ years one can get a retirement visa (but I am only 36 years old, so this doesn't apply to me).

- I can work for a company inside the country and get a work visa. Easily do-able as a software developer, but obviously will earn a lot less compared to North Western Europe. But earning 2.500 EUR a month as software dev is still a lot, about 5x the average income.

- At least one company allows you to freelance and they handle taxes for you and give you a work permit. But all invoices should be handled through this company and they take a 30% cut.

There are some other ways as well, like an investor visa if you invest a large amount of money in the country.

I will go for the second option for now, pay for the 5-year visa. After 5 years I could extend this with a 10-year visa. And from then on I can use a retirement visa.

Post reply on HN