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Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

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Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#41
> ...will also reduce costs by not having to run a Windows and LiMux client side-by-side.

Mind that this means "reduce costs in comparison to moving to another non-Windows OS". They still do not have a cost calculation that would promise long-term savings and I'd call it unlikely at least that there will be savings, as the previous city mayor reported huge savings after the migration to LiMux.

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#42
post #10

That's not at all what it says. The cost of moving to Windows and office is ~€5 million: >€ 4.8 million and licenses (for Microsoft Windows, Microsoft Office, software distribution, The €50 is for hardware replacements that were going to happen anyway. Nothing in the article addresses the harder to track costs of user efficiency and expert support staff. I'm not claiming it's cheaper in either direction, but staffing…

From the text: > the former open-source champion would pay €49.3 million to create a new Windows 10 client OS I don't know what you mean by calling a "new client OS" "hardware replacements that were going to happen anyway". I find the sentence confusing itself, as the OS would be microsoft, maybe they mean a distribution with preinstalled software? Either way, I don't read it to mean hardware replacemens

I find it equally hard to read that sentence and assume they're actually spending €50m to create a new OS when whole point of the article is that they're switching to an OS that already exists. the only assumption i can make is that the author of the article doesn't know what they're talking about.

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#43
post #7

Meanwhile: https://www.itworld.com/article/2716115/operating-systems/sw... I'm sure Munich council's decision to switch back to Windows, despite all the costs and long-term lock-in, had nothing to do with this totally random HQ-building in Munich: https://mspoweruser.com/microsoft-germany-moves-into-a-new-h...

If MS built their HQ in Munich because of that then it's an absolutely amazing deal for Munich.

Just the tax on salaries from those 1900 people working there will pay off the costs of switching to Windows in a very short time.

And as a nice bonus I'm sure that 28% of users that "have severe issues related to software, which could be solved by migrating these users to Windows and MS Office."[0] will also be happy.

[0]: https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2017/02/14/statemen...

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#44

I think it should all be web based with some random thin clients.

That is what they're wanting to move to. They asked the Microsoft partner Accenture, who could sell a lot of Windows clients here, to evaluate their IT situation and not even they dared to throw their reputation away and somehow suggest that Windows is a necessity. They also just suggested a thin-client architecture.

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#45
post #21

I think Microsoft must have a very powerful lobby tackling this potential "end of an era" event. With more companies moving analytics from Excel to Python, other data science tools, cloud or not... And governments adopting ODF as document standards. Not to mention the free beer.

Microsoft did recently move their German headquarters from slightly outside of Munich's tax area to inside of Munich's tax area...

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#46
post #7

Meanwhile: https://www.itworld.com/article/2716115/operating-systems/sw... I'm sure Munich council's decision to switch back to Windows, despite all the costs and long-term lock-in, had nothing to do with this totally random HQ-building in Munich: https://mspoweruser.com/microsoft-germany-moves-into-a-new-h...

If MS built their HQ in Munich because of that then it's an absolutely amazing deal for Munich. Just the tax on salaries from those 1900 people working there will pay off the costs of switching to Windows in a very short time. And as a nice bonus I'm sure that 28% of users that "have severe issues related to software, which could be solved by migrating these users to Windows and MS Office."[0] will also be happy. [0]…

Most of that tax money would not go to the city level government though.

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#47
post #7

Meanwhile: https://www.itworld.com/article/2716115/operating-systems/sw... I'm sure Munich council's decision to switch back to Windows, despite all the costs and long-term lock-in, had nothing to do with this totally random HQ-building in Munich: https://mspoweruser.com/microsoft-germany-moves-into-a-new-h...

If MS built their HQ in Munich because of that then it's an absolutely amazing deal for Munich. Just the tax on salaries from those 1900 people working there will pay off the costs of switching to Windows in a very short time. And as a nice bonus I'm sure that 28% of users that "have severe issues related to software, which could be solved by migrating these users to Windows and MS Office."[0] will also be happy. [0]…

They moved their HQ from just outside the city border to inside the city. I doubt many of the employees will move (salary is taxed at the place of residence).

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#48
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If MS built their HQ in Munich because of that then it's an absolutely amazing deal for Munich. Just the tax on salaries from those 1900 people working there will pay off the costs of switching to Windows in a very short time. And as a nice bonus I'm sure that 28% of users that "have severe issues related to software, which could be solved by migrating these users to Windows and MS Office."[0] will also be happy. [0]…

Most of that tax money would not go to the city level government though.

15% of tax revenue ends up at the municipality to be exact.

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#49
post #10

That's not at all what it says. The cost of moving to Windows and office is ~€5 million: >€ 4.8 million and licenses (for Microsoft Windows, Microsoft Office, software distribution, The €50 is for hardware replacements that were going to happen anyway. Nothing in the article addresses the harder to track costs of user efficiency and expert support staff. I'm not claiming it's cheaper in either direction, but staffing…

Costs are as follow:

    - 14   Mio € for personal costs
    - 24   Mio € for consulting (not sure why that is that high?!)
    - 13,4 Mio € for it@M services (support, hardware installation, etc it@M is the it company that manages the project)
    -  4,8 Mio € for HARDWARE
    - 29,9 Mio € for Licenses (Microsoft Windows, Microsoft Office, software delivery, License-, Print-, and Profile Management, identity management and extension of the virtualisation environment)
(to be fair the pdf quotes that a big cost will be the investment into additional virtualisation, probably licenses)

Source: https://www.ris-muenchen.de/RII/RII/DOK/SITZUNGSVORLAGE/4740...

Somebody read over the 'and' (edit:) and to be fair it's a wierd way of expressing something that is so important in german. probably an intention.

Re: Windows 10 switchover will cost Linux champion Munich €50m

#50
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Users should not be fiddling with the parts of the environment that change between Windows and Linux. Users should not be sticking USB sticks, setting up printers and so on. They should run the programs they are supposed to run in order to work.

Maybe they have to touch those things in order to make their workflow optimal, or even work in the first place. One of my big issues with the Linux Desktop community is this attitude that they understand your workflow better than you do. You ask how to do something and you get variations of "don't do that".

I wouldn't assume whoever designed the specific desktop implementation and the software these people run is completely naïve about their workflows.

> You ask how to do something and you get variations of "don't do that".

I usually add "do [something appropriate] instead, which will solve the problem and not introduce a [horrific IT risk]".

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