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To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

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Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#111

Post by jrs235 »

neom wrote: post #103
jrs235 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair enough. If the ISPs don't what to be liable for the content that traverses their network then they ought to be neutral to content and not prioritize traffic based on it's content (or source, destination, protocol, etc). But if they are inspecting the packets then they should have some liability for what they are delivering and the content on their network. The ISPs want it both ways like someone else mentioned,…

How about they don't inspect any content, but I download the media player provided by my ISP and it doesn't contribute to my data cap, but netflix does?

I would think if they have data caps then they will have to determine how much data their own content consumes and count it against the data cap. Otherwise this is abusing their network monopoly to support and provide an unfair advantage to their content business.

Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#114

Post by [deleted] »

jrs235 wrote: post #111
neom wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about they don't inspect any content, but I download the media player provided by my ISP and it doesn't contribute to my data cap, but netflix does?

I would think if they have data caps then they will have to determine how much data their own content consumes and count it against the data cap. Otherwise this is abusing their network monopoly to support and provide an unfair advantage to their content business.

[deleted]

Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#115

Post by mirimir »

betterunix2 wrote: post #78
rdtsc wrote: post #9

> A future in which ISPs are owned by local governments, small businesses, nonprofit community groups, and the people they serve are the path forward and the only realistic way of ending big telecom’s stranglehold on America. I'd like that. These day internet access is more like a utility. It helps people telecommute, do banking, grocery shopping even, pay bills, etc. If municipalities can handle providing water and…

"The free market competition among the providers is just not happening and will probably never happen in a lot of areas." Actually, we know exactly how to create a competitive market: line sharing rules. We used to have line sharing requirements for DSL and there were dozens of competing services in most cities. The situation we face today is the result of those rules being eliminated during the Bush administration.

Right. Line sharing works for electricity.

When I first used DSL, I could choose among many ISPs. All delivered through the same legacy copper.

Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#116

Post by sctb »

madshiva wrote: post #38

Like net neutrality will come from U.S. or with President of U.S. Don't forgot, it's your boat that are sinking. Do you see U.S. falling down? because it's what happen.

We've already asked you to stop posting like this, so we've banned the account. We're happy to unban accounts if you email us at hn@ycombinator.com and we believe you'll follow the guidelines in the future.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#117

Post by AnthonyMouse »

neom wrote: post #97
jrs235 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ISPs (with their local market monopolies) are also content providers. How is them using their network/distribution monopoly to gain an unfair advantage for their content distribution different from Microsoft using their OS to gain an unfair advantage for their browser in the 90's? Isn't NN about constraining unfair competition practices?

That is FTC not FCC.

> That is FTC not FCC.

It's the FTC in the case of Microsoft because Microsoft isn't a carrier. Regulating communications carriers is the FCC's entire purpose.

Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#118

Post by wfo »

jrs235 wrote: post #87
notacoward wrote: post #85

I'm in favor of network neutrality myself. My main criticism is that it doesn't go far enough , in that it only requires neutrality from network providers to content providers but not vice versa or like-to-like. But I do have a serious question for other supporters. How can so many of those who are usually anti-regulatory "free market" extremists also be so strongly in favor of this regulation? * This is their theory…

>How can so many of those who are usually anti-regulatory "free market" extremists also be so strongly in favor of this regulation? Because in the US, network providers (at least the last mile providers; those charging end consumers) are local monopolies. Most people in the US have one legit high speed internet option, a few have two. There is little competition and the barriers to entry for new comers is very high (…

Every time a monopoly arises, that is the market telling you the most efficient way to produce the good is with a single centrally planned organization, and that competition is not possible or effective.

A monopoly is the market's way of saying an industry/service should be nationalized.

Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#119

Post by libertyEQ »

StavrosK wrote: post #63
DiThi wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most countries like to copy the most successful country on Earth. You probably think of things like software patents, that were rejected in the EU. But that was a very long fight! I hope we don't even have to _start_ the net neutrality fight in the EU, by winning it outside.

Copy the most successful country in the world? Who would want a great firewall?

Sorry to sound like a nationalist here (i'm not), but the US has 1/3rd the population of China yet still has the largest economy, and the goto reserve currency. China actually has an ownership stake in all of their IT companies.

Contrary to a sibling comment, NN paves the way for the government to regulate what a private company can do with their IT assets, and therefore a great firewall situation.

Re: To Save Net Neutrality, We Must Build Our Own Internet

#120

Post by em3rgent0rdr »

pmilot wrote: post #82
voycey wrote: post #16

Decentralising the Internet is the only way we are going to be able to stop corporations from lobbying (aka bribing) the government to make decisions in their favour. Check out https://substratum.net/ - they have an idea to do just that. As our computers get more and more powerful then there is no reason why we cant distribute more of what forces the internet to be centralised, if no one controls it then it can be fr…

Unless I'm misunderstanding it, the Substratum project you've linked is attempting to implement a decentralized WEB, not a decentralized INTERNET. From what I gather, Substratum would still be running on the same internet backbone, and be subject to the same consequences if Net Neutrality is repelled.

Hypothetically a project like substratum could include internet bandwidth itself as another resource which is rewarded with substratum.
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