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Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

nature.com

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Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#101

Post by simonh »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #79
ethagnawl wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the experiences which led to me becoming a vegetarian was ordering a whole lobster and being forced to pick it apart bit by bit. It's easy to forget/dismiss that the "stuff" inside your lobster roll was ever a living, breathing, thinking being. However, when you're handed the whole animal, told to crack it open and stuff it into your mouth, it's a very different story.

On the other hand, I have gutted and butchered whole animals before, and still happily eat meat. Good on you for sticking to your morals though. I don't mind vegetarians or vegans or whatever, but the one group that really annoys me is people who eat meat, but get upset seeing animals get butchered.

My grandfather was a slaughterman for a while and a really good butcher. When he talked about the animals going to be killed he said he could tell many of them at the end probably knew what was going to happen to them. It clearly did bother him a bit and he did feel sorry for the animals but said it was quick and humane overall. In everyday life he hated to see animals mistreated or suffering. There’s no hypocrisy in showing some emotion, especially when it’s something you’ve not experienced before.

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#102

Post by indubitable »

Simon_says wrote: post #12
stevenwoo wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's long been thought that a large percentage of studies on mice can not be replicated in humans because we are such different species but we use mice because it is cheap. http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/the_mouse_t... Some larger animals might be somewhat closer but a.) much more expensive b.) more ethically challenging to kill/drug something more intelligent at the scale at which we do mice An acq…

I bought some live lobsters to kill (humanely, with a knife to the brain) and steam. I only had him in my custody for a couple hours, but I got attached. I had a bad experience thinking about taking a life, and it kinda fucked me up. I don't think I'll be doing it again. If I had to kill everything I ate, I'd be vegetarian. But I have no problem buying it at the store.

This is something of a pet peeve of mine. Somebody will post a hunting video or whatever and people, who otherwise enjoy meat, will freak out watching an animal die. The irony is that the way these animals die, with a clean lung shot or whatever, is a vastly more humane than the stuff the mass production meat you buy at the store is put through. They live their lives in the wild open and free as they see fit. And after a few seconds it ends with their brains so full pumped of endorphins that they likely don't feel a thing.

Compare that to store meat and you're looking at things that lived in cramped uncomfortable quarters and spent their lives being pumped full of antibiotic agents just to try to prevent them from becoming too sick before they're sent off a slaughter line where all their senses are going to inform them well ahead of time what's coming. And then enter in things like the growth hormones we use (that have been banned in much of the rest of the developed world) that often result in ongoing pain and other issues for the animals again before they're lined up for slaughter. Then there are straight up sadistic things like foie gras. That involves force feeding animals, generally ducks, to increase their liver to ~10x its normal size by shoving a pipe down their throat and jamming in "food" over a period of many weeks.

Cooking that lobster (or hunting deer or whatever else) is vastly more humane than supporting our meat industry. Like many things that happen on scale, ethics are quickly replaced with an insatiable lust for profit. I enjoy traveling and something I like more than anything else is to go into a chicken and rice shop and see some chickens freely pecking about around the shop. We should understand where our food comes from, and give it the respect it deserves. That doesn't mean not killing it, but it does mean giving it as reasonable a life as possible in the interim.

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#103

Post by jacobush »

batiudrami wrote: post #72
Simon_says wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bought some live lobsters to kill (humanely, with a knife to the brain) and steam. I only had him in my custody for a couple hours, but I got attached. I had a bad experience thinking about taking a life, and it kinda fucked me up. I don't think I'll be doing it again. If I had to kill everything I ate, I'd be vegetarian. But I have no problem buying it at the store.

You might find being vegetarian easier than you think. It's a little more effort while you learn new recipes, and depending on where you live you'll have less choice when you dine out, but I have been (mostly) vegetarian for the last two years and found it surprisingly easy. :)

Some experience for me. Unfortunately, after a couple of years, it was also easy to relapse when my social circles changed.

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#104

Post by ancarda »

oihssovhusvoh wrote: post #93
legohead wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rodent research is a horrible testing method. This video explains it well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHl0nIdbiLA

that's basically a condescending mansplain

Are men not allowed to teach? Adam Ruins Everything is an educational show - they’re all actors

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#105

Post by RyanZAG »

simonh wrote: post #91
RyanZAG wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if it's just plain old XX vs XY chromosomes?

So rats have a built in gene sequencer and detect the base pairs directly?

Probably not, but why is that so far fetched? They'd just need to be dissolving it with chemicals, backed up by a neural network to identify the sequence (rat's brain, anyone?). That's kind of how smell works in general to begin with.

As for why rats may develop the ability to sequence XX vs XY - if rats with the ability to do so were killed far less than those without, then rats would quickly evolve the ability to do so. This could happen if males were the ones killing rats and not females. Actually, skip the 'probably not' I began with - it's a perfectly likely explanation that may or may not be true based on further study.

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#106

Post by rimliu »

simonh wrote: post #91
RyanZAG wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if it's just plain old XX vs XY chromosomes?

So rats have a built in gene sequencer and detect the base pairs directly?

Your friend's eye color is defined by some genes. You don't need a gene sequencer to see what they are.

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#107

Post by simias »

cristianpascu wrote: post #89
rodrodrod wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The research is concerned with sex, not gender. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_and_gender_distinction

Whatever the Holy Wikipedia says about the distinction, isn't it funny, not to say something else, that we use the same words for two/three concepts that are, supposedly, completely different and vary independently? I'm a male identifying as female expressing as male, aka sex:gender:gender-expression. Because, you know, people were so dumb until social-constructivism landed on Earth like the Messiah no-one expected.…

Please let's not. It's off topic and we all know that it won't lead to constructive discussion.

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#108

Post by oihssovhusvoh »

ancarda wrote: post #104
oihssovhusvoh wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that's basically a condescending mansplain

Are men not allowed to teach? Adam Ruins Everything is an educational show - they’re all actors

the man depicted in the animation is explaining only to women

the actors behind the cartoon are reading a script written by someone...are you fooled by the puppetry ?

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#109

Post by pennaMan »

ygaf wrote: post #59
DonHopkins wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You said "haven't been there for years" which means you came from 4chan. So does your behavior, pretending you don't know the word "trap" or purposefully mis-gendering is an insult to transgender people. That bullshit doesn't play here. You still haven't asked any questions worth answering. https://www.glaad.org/reference/transgender >Defamatory Language >Defamatory: "deceptive," "fooling," "pretending," "posing," "t…

>pretending you don't know the word "trap" I'm not pretending to not know the word; it made sense on sight to me as "someone who fools you". Easiest term around. And that is clearly a concept of its own not a synonym for transsexuals , hence my confusion when a poster gets flagged for an affront to them. You have actually been helpful now though, despite thinking you're slamdunking me. Passing is a bad word now too?…

Am I in the South Park version of hn?

Re: Ketamine lifts rodents' mood only if administered by male researchers

#110

Post by rootlocus »

oihssovhusvoh wrote: post #108
ancarda wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are men not allowed to teach? Adam Ruins Everything is an educational show - they’re all actors

the man depicted in the animation is explaining only to women the actors behind the cartoon are reading a script written by someone...are you fooled by the puppetry ?

> the actors behind the cartoon are reading a script written by someone...

So.. it really doesn't matter who teaches and who listens, because ultimately they're both actors reading from a script. How does that play in favor of your argument?

Not to mention the woman he's explaining to is a scientist researcher, and at the end of the video, they have Dr. Azra Raza as a guest (who is also a woman) to further solidify the arguments.

If you think you're defending anything by calling it "mansplaining" and complaining that women aren't treated fairly, you're wrong and you're not helping anyone.

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