Live data from Hacker News

Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

mobile.nytimes.com

51–60 of 190 posts

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#51
post #38

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fukushima_Daiichi_nuclear_disa... reminds us that nuclear kills much less than regular earthquakes, car accidents, or air pollution due to the burning of fossil fuels...

I’m not worried about how many people nuclear power kills every year. I’m worried about how many people it kills every hundred years. A major nuclear disaster, however unlikely, has the potential to kill millions of people and leave a big portion of the Earth uninhabitable for centuries. Just because we haven’t seen one on that scale yet, doesn’t mean we never will.

By nuclear disaster do you mean weapons use or just a power generation accident? I've never heard of a power plant accident potentially leaving a big portion of the Earth uninhabitable for centuries, but if there is something please enlighten me!

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#52
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Kind of surprising at this point Fukushima was built when the nuclear power industry was 13 years old. Now it's 63 years old. You are seeing the folly of youth, with consequences delayed 60 years, not a design that would be typical of new construction.

Sounds like life :| Those cigarettes you smoked in your early twenties? Those beers you smashed working in IT? 63 will be interesting..

The trick is not to give in to peer pressure.

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nuclear scientist's weren't like "naive" teenagers though. Sure the design could've been better; However by your logic they had 50 years to take extra safety pre-cautions and improve the structure. In-fact, it still absolutely amazes me it was even running at the time of the disaster and built on a coast in a country notorious for Tsunamis.

> improve the structure The key question is: Who would have paid for it? Once running, much of the structure is considered to be radioactive. Work in active radioactive areas is expensive and time consuming. Without shutting down the reactor entirely followed by an expensive cleanup, doing major structure upgrades to the reactor chambers is virtually impossible. They also couldn't just decommission it once they reali…

> Who would have paid for it?

The disaster could have been prevented by the simple expedient of elevating the backup generators, or putting them in flood-resistant bunkers. Cheap.

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#54
post #8

Kind of surprising at this point that there’s not an area directly below the bottom of the reactor with a giant ceramic catch basin (or something similarly heat resistant) to catch these failures and cleared of pipes etc so when this happens cleanup workers know the location of the materials.

I remember reading articles right after the disaster saying some engineers/scientists tried to warn people that the design had some critical safety flaws..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GE_Three

But not sure this really points to lack of caution?

Personally, I think we need low carbon power sources, but emotionally (irrationally?) nuclear fission always feels like "apes toying with God's fire"

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#55
post #8

Kind of surprising at this point that there’s not an area directly below the bottom of the reactor with a giant ceramic catch basin (or something similarly heat resistant) to catch these failures and cleared of pipes etc so when this happens cleanup workers know the location of the materials.

I still think they should fight fire with for. A small tactical nuclear bomb just inland of the plant could blow it all into the ocean where the material would sink. ;-)

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#56
post #38

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fukushima_Daiichi_nuclear_disa... reminds us that nuclear kills much less than regular earthquakes, car accidents, or air pollution due to the burning of fossil fuels...

Go and live there if you think that it is really harmless. I would rather not honestly after it took them 6 years just to get the first image of the corium after endless attempts.

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Kind of surprising at this point Fukushima was built when the nuclear power industry was 13 years old. Now it's 63 years old. You are seeing the folly of youth, with consequences delayed 60 years, not a design that would be typical of new construction.

Nuclear scientist's weren't like "naive" teenagers though. Sure the design could've been better; However by your logic they had 50 years to take extra safety pre-cautions and improve the structure. In-fact, it still absolutely amazes me it was even running at the time of the disaster and built on a coast in a country notorious for Tsunamis.

> Nuclear scientist's weren't like "naive" teenagers though.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_and_radiation_accident...

Not only scientists but the whole humanity is acting like "naive teenagers" here.

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#58
post #16

Does anyone know how they extract the molten fuel? Sounds like they will use more robots, but if it's taken this long just to get a robot to see the target, how on earth does a robot retrieve this stuff? Must be a career defining experience for these robotists, doing something that can really help an awful situation

They don't have the slightest idea. It's an absolute miracle that they just managed to get a picture of the molten core after 6 years. Now probably they can start to think what to do, but my guess is that they don't have any idea at the moment.

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#59
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what they did in this particular instance, but basically there are two things you can do: shield, or in the case of electronics, use larger parts. The smaller some piece of electronics is, the smaller the charges in there are, and the easier it is to introduce errors with ionizing radiation.

And the design of the electronics might help with radiation tolerance. Computation paths could be redundant to detect/eliminate bit flips due to radiaton. (Some server Power cpus seem to run parallel in pairs, comparing the output at critical parts to detect cpu errors)

Basically the same as in space exploration. Also running at very low MHz.

Re: Six Years After Fukushima, Robots Finally Find Reactors’ Melted Uranium Fuel

#60
post #38

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fukushima_Daiichi_nuclear_disa... reminds us that nuclear kills much less than regular earthquakes, car accidents, or air pollution due to the burning of fossil fuels...

I’m not worried about how many people nuclear power kills every year. I’m worried about how many people it kills every hundred years. A major nuclear disaster, however unlikely, has the potential to kill millions of people and leave a big portion of the Earth uninhabitable for centuries. Just because we haven’t seen one on that scale yet, doesn’t mean we never will.

Every year it kills 100 times less than every hundred years, that’s how average works, no matter what exact period you’re worried about. Also, no nuclear disaster ever killed millions — it is barely possible even with nuclear weapons. Relocation and financial risks, yes.

Likelihood of such disaster is estimated to be too minor to not care about, say, “an asteroid kills the planet” movie scenario.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/scientists-say-nuclear-...

http://www.ucsusa.org/nuclear-power/nuclear-waste/safer-stor...

Post reply on HN