Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

quora.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 411 posts

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#71

Post by tptacek »

I was going to add this as a reply to a comment downthread but I think it's too important to bury.

The fundamental rule of career progression in the technology industry is to position yourself as a domain expert in something more specific than "programming".

It's very difficult to "own" "programming" in a way where you can use scarcity to drive integer multiple increases of the median salary. It is not as difficult to "own" distributed systems, sensor fusion, software security, or OS kernels.

As a general rule, the people getting outlandish half-mil-a-year offers from big tech companies are domain experts, and the people on Twitter shocked and upset that they're never seeing these offers are either (a) generalists or (b) people who have chosen to specialize on the craft of programming, rather than a domain to which programming can be applied.

That's not a value judgement! There are a lot of ways in which refining a true engineering discipline for assembling software is harder than kernel development or fast computer vision processing. It's just a statement about supply and demand, and about ease of demonstrating value.

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#72

Post by timr »

madflame991 wrote: post #61
timr wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Find a niche that rewards experience in something other than code. This could be non-technical (e.g. "business"), or it could be something more deeply technical (e.g. scaling, machine learning, search, etc.) To some extent, the older you get, the more this happens, naturally. But you can and should make strategic decisions about where you choose to devote your attention. The important principle is that you should dev…

Why would JS be less long-term-valuable? It's only 4 years younger than linux, it's more common than linux and has a much larger community (especially compared to the linux kernel driver one). I don't see either going anywhere in the next 20 years.

I changed it to "Javascript framework" to stop triggering the JS devs here, while making the identical point: if you specialize in a technology that was invented last year, you are taking a big risk that it won't survive. If you pick a technology that has been in active use for over 20 years and is currently popular, you are taking less of a risk. This is harder to do, but like many things that are hard, the reward is higher.

I really wish it were possible to make reference to JS in a less-than-glowing light without being downvoted, but alas. Substitute any other brand-new technology for "Javascript framework" if you're having difficulty seeing the argument.

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#73

Post by codingdave »

paul7986 wrote: post #65

..

I've found that today, that list of skills you have is a equivalent to a few years ago only knowing HTML & CSS, but nothing else. The bar is higher. So yes, you need to pick up new skills. That being said, I'd concentrate on your core coding skills, not just adding "Angular" to your resume. Be able to knock the whiteboard-coding style interview out of the park, show them you really know your stuff, are smart, have some CS chops, etc... and then ask them to let you learn the frameworks on the fly.

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#74

Post by cgh »

marktangotango wrote: post #49
lliamander wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then let me ask: how do you make it past 40 in software? Specifically, how do you position yourself so that you are actively sought after (rather than merely employable)?

Java and Spring, or C# and .net. Java is derided as the next cobol, but there is a lot of new development, lots of jobs, and strong demand for senior talent. Source; me, been doing java since 2003. Age 40+.

Can confirm. Also, I suspect a lot of this "there's no life after 40" stuff mainly relates to startups and certain small companies. It certainly doesn't apply to BigCorps.

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#75

Post by ElatedOwl »

zoul wrote: post #54
ChuckMcM wrote: post #4

The answer is pretty reasonable in the Quora post (Answer: no). In my experience, people who get something more out writing software than a salary tend to stay in software development, at some level, for their entire career. That said, if you're a software developer and you're also good at communicating and managing people, seriously consider moving into management. While I think the stories of the '10x' developer ar…

Isn’t it a big loss to move into management when one loves to code?

Personally, I loved to code, but management has been much more fulfilling for me. Helping my team grow, professionally and personally, is a hugely rewarding experience. I still get to exercise some problem solving skills (though I let my developers make the technical decisions) and I still help craft a great user experience, which were my favorite parts of being a developer anyway.

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#76

Post by [deleted] »

madflame991 wrote: post #61
timr wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Find a niche that rewards experience in something other than code. This could be non-technical (e.g. "business"), or it could be something more deeply technical (e.g. scaling, machine learning, search, etc.) To some extent, the older you get, the more this happens, naturally. But you can and should make strategic decisions about where you choose to devote your attention. The important principle is that you should dev…

Why would JS be less long-term-valuable? It's only 4 years younger than linux, it's more common than linux and has a much larger community (especially compared to the linux kernel driver one). I don't see either going anywhere in the next 20 years.

[deleted]

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#77

Post by otakucode »

It depends highly on how you approach development I imagine. I'm 38 and I've got no problems. But I'm also single with no kids and spend basically every spare minute outside of work in front of a computer, as I have done since about age 9. I've worked with many people who just want a simple job, something they can coast on... and there are absolutely jobs for people that want that sort of position. Management is typically like that, since they rarely do anything challenging or unusual or requiring taking risks or being creative. But as developers, there are also lots of antiquated systems which will continue to be maintained until they fail catastrophically and completely. Young developers are usually far less capable of dealing with such systems than older ones are.

Just take a modern full-stack developer and ask them to describe what a processor is actually doing sometime. They are used to working at such an extreme level of abstraction above the hardware that they don't usually have the slightest idea what's actually going on in the hardware. To them transpiling other languages into javascript didn't even sound like proposing the inmates get to repaint the asylum in their own scat for a long time.

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#78

Post by crdoconnor »

nvarsj wrote: post #51
elliottcarlson wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 37 and would rather not stick to a niche personally. Being able to quickly adapt and grow keeps the job interesting to me.

Yeah, niches don’t last in our field. Sure, become an expert in akka, kubernetes, or whatever tech is fashionable now - in 10 years it will be like you were an expert in CORBA. It’s a little annoying how you have to chase tech fashion to remain employable though. As if simply being a good engineer isn’t enough to pick up these techs and contribute meaningfully. You need to spend your free time learning the tech, or b…

It's better to stay away from the super-hyped technologies IMHO. They might provide a few years of higher earnings but they have a bad habit of flaring out, rendering all of that hard earned knowledge useless.

Re: Is software development really a dead-end job after age 35-40?

#80

Post by caffed »

lliamander wrote: post #40
Gargoyle wrote: post #22

In the general sense, this is the wrong place to ask. It's a self-selecting group in that most people over 40 here will be among the group that lasted in the career. It won't give a sense of how large that group is in the wider world, nor how many didn't stick with it. On the other hand, if you want to hear how to make it past 40 in software, this is probably an excellent place to ask!

Then let me ask: how do you make it past 40 in software? Specifically, how do you position yourself so that you are actively sought after (rather than merely employable)?

- Keep your knowledge/experience relevant - Stay focused and positive - Promote collaboration, ownership, and leadership

Think of it like being on a first date: your idealized self. You're real, but like 120% real.

Post reply on HN