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There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
141–150 of 474 posts
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
The problem that you don't notice is the lack of security updates.
Right? It may still largely be functional, but I would never trust that device in the open, it's just ripe for a bevy of attacks. I really wish Google would expand their service lifetime on their own devices, because I feel 2 years is really too short.
Two years is completely too short, even three years if you purchase mid-cycle is not enough.
I own Nexus 5X's on Project Fi, one bootlooped and was replaced, the other still going strong after ~20months. I also have a Pixel XL acquired like 7 months ago, both of those should outlive the updates and giving Google the money directly, they should take care of their customers.
Far from an Apple fan boy, the 2016 MBP and 2017 iPad do not worry me about getting forgotten in the ever ongoing updates.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#143Up until very recently if I had an old 386 I could still install modern Linux on it and use gnu apps.
Whereas if I have a 2 year old phone the official story is: no it totally doesn't work, throw it away.
This is garbage. Phones are a lot more powerful then that 386, what's different is no one is building to any reasonable standard. Kernel updates should just work.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#144With current and older devices working perfectly well, and new devices being even less serviceable and more user-hostile with greater efforts towards planned obolescence, is it any wonder that people just aren't "upgrading" any more? I don't consider this a problem, but a sign of an ecosystem that is gaining stability. In fact I'd say it's even better, from an e-waste perspective, that the amount of churn has decreas…
How are you so certain obsolescence is planned?
I have seen a prepaid device literally self-destruct from a combination of market segmenting and artificial firmware restrictions.
Edit: There was no CM support, no way to delete bloatware, forcibly disabled SD storage support, and non-optional updates that eventually rendered the device unusable. The two end-user choices were to either remain offline or get stuck in "not enough free space" loops.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#145Earlier quoted context omitted.
Windows has mostly kept a stable driver API. And whenever they broke that API, that actually happened — suddenly updates stopped being usable by your system. Also, be aware that ARM has nothing to enumerate devices, has no BISO or UEFI. An OS image will only ever work on a single device. As I detailed in another comment in this thread, the issue is this collision of the Linux concept of mainlining everything, short s…
Windows driver API has been far from stable from Windows Vista. One of my computers came with Windows Vista (a 2009 Dell Pentium Dual Core - not the Core 2 Duo I referenced) and it still runs Windows 10. Microsoft provided drivers for the standard PC hardware that was in my 2006 Core Duo Mac Mini and Windows 7 recognized all of my hardware - usb, sound, graphics, Bluetooth, Ethernet etc. Microsoft goes out of its way…
Have you looked at the unimaginable amount of crap a typical Windows printer driver forces upon you?
Yes. I go out of my way to run a clean crap free Windows PC. Even going as far as either buying from the business line of laptops or buying from the Microsoft store. But the minute I install a printer driver....
It's even worse for people like my parents, they search online for printer driver and usually end up downloading crapware from a third party site unaffiliated with the printer manufacture.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#146Earlier quoted context omitted.
Security, basically. If you care about your privacy, you should care about security (can't have one with the other). You need updated phone for that.
Well, that's not a real issue, is it? It's purely a decision from the manufacturers to be assholes to their customers. There is no technical need that'd prevent them from creating updates. Especially Samsung (which also produces the SoC in-house for all relevant markets).
I don't think not providing updates makes them assholes. Its just the reality of the traditional software model gradually becoming obsolete. They paid the developers to write software, and as a consumer we paid for that software. The cost of additional development has to be borne by someone. The success of the subscription model from biggies like MS, Adobe, Blizzard, SAAS startups, etc has shown that atleast one other model is viable. Its up to others' to show that there can be others.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#147With current and older devices working perfectly well, and new devices being even less serviceable and more user-hostile with greater efforts towards planned obolescence, is it any wonder that people just aren't "upgrading" any more? I don't consider this a problem, but a sign of an ecosystem that is gaining stability. In fact I'd say it's even better, from an e-waste perspective, that the amount of churn has decreas…
Security, basically. If you care about your privacy, you should care about security (can't have one with the other). You need updated phone for that.
That shouldn't be the trade-off, though.
I think your average smartphone owner doesn't understand all this anyway. They look at their 3-year-old phone and say "it works fine and does what I need it to do", look at the new ones on the market and say "I don't see anything compelling there to justify that price tag", and so they don't buy a new phone. Most people don't realize that their phone has gaping security holes in it that will never be addressed.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
Windows has mostly kept a stable driver API. And whenever they broke that API, that actually happened — suddenly updates stopped being usable by your system. Also, be aware that ARM has nothing to enumerate devices, has no BISO or UEFI. An OS image will only ever work on a single device. As I detailed in another comment in this thread, the issue is this collision of the Linux concept of mainlining everything, short s…
Why does the kernel and driver ABI matter for upgrading userland? On desktop Linux I can by and large use a new kernel and chroot into an old install, or vice versa, and things still work. It would seem that Android userland is unnecessarily coupled to a specific kernel version. It should be able to upgrade independently.
Agreed in principle, but a decent amount of the new security features present in more recent Android phones are due to new kernel features. It's just a sign of the relative immaturity of the platform that this is the case.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#149The flipside of this is that developers are forced to support versions of their apps that are compatible with previous operating systems. That's bad for developers, but good for consumers. iPhones shove updates down your throat as a user. They're so persistent that inevitably most people will accept the new update - and even if you're stubborn like me, eventually your apps will no longer be supported under the newer…
>The problem is that the OS upgrades invariably slow down older phones, so even if you're perfectly happy with your iPhone to begin with, it starts to act slow as it gets the newer OS's. It's good that Android users can at least avoid this particular kind of planned obsolescence
I have seen this first hand with my 4S. The updates slowed down my phone, which I was perfectly happy with. Unfortunately, Apple blocks you from restoring your phone's OS back to when it worked great. Heh, and then I bought the 6S, so I suppose Apple got my money anyway.
Re: There are over a billion outdated Android devices in use
#150With current and older devices working perfectly well, and new devices being even less serviceable and more user-hostile with greater efforts towards planned obolescence, is it any wonder that people just aren't "upgrading" any more? I don't consider this a problem, but a sign of an ecosystem that is gaining stability. In fact I'd say it's even better, from an e-waste perspective, that the amount of churn has decreas…
Security, basically. If you care about your privacy, you should care about security (can't have one with the other). You need updated phone for that.
Not having a smart phone is probably up there with being serious about security.