I think Brendan must have worked with quite a lot of brilliant jerks in the ZFS appliance days at Sun/Oracle. The Fishworks team was excellent but some of the top heads were quite toxic.
Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
91–100 of 243 posts
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#92I am an Alice and I need some feedback as why is it a bad thing! I work in an environment when very small percentage of people know what are they doing. and people that know what is going on do not speak up because they are frustrated and know probably nothing will change. in this environment I do speak up whenever I get a chance and I've been in arguments with managers 3 4 level above me. everybody else wants to be…
> why am I wrong ?
I'll bite.
Does it work? Is your approach effective?
In your engagement with the senior folk, do you just complain? Or do you suggest changes that you know are affordable and achievable? Are you arguing so you feel better about trying or are you genuinely attempting to affect change?
Also, has it occurred to you that the higher ups might not be the fools and cowards they appear? Is it possible that they are operating with constraints that they just haven't chosen, or are prevented from, sharing with you?
Obviously I don't know your organisation and it is, of course, possible that its staffed with incompetents. And that by sheer good fortune just you and a small group of your immediate colleagues are the only rational actors. Or it may be something else.
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#93The situation I've encountered is a jerk who was actually fairly mediocre in his abilities but whose bully characteristics and brash confidence had led many of the non-technical people in the company to believe he was extremely skilled. I think one reason people become bullies is because they know they can't back up their decisions with skill. Linus is brash, but is quite able to work well with people and has the res…
Yeah it doesn't help that a lot of programmers are traditionally "nerds" who have grown up being bullied by others (I did). It is possible to understand how to handle this kind of behaviors though. I would wager that most software engineers could certainly learn a bit more about behavioral psychology. In particular, although it is still a little taboo, I would recommend talking to a therapist even if one doesn't seem…
> In particular, although it is still a little taboo, I would recommend talking to a therapist even if one doesn't seem to exhibit any explicit pathologies.
it is? wow that's sad. there's all kinds of therapists and lots are pretty crappy but I don't see the benefit to society by creating a "taboo" around the entire concept of talking about your personal problems to a paid advisor.
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#94I'm not entirely sure I subscribe to this "behavior based" vs "merit based" look at job performance. Consider this criterion: > 1. After encountering the person, do people feel oppressed, humiliated or otherwise worse about themselves? Bob and Mary are staunch members of . While they never discuss it at work, Mary deeply resents the views Bob posts on social media. During a code review, Bob is bluntly critical of Mar…
> Bob and Mary are staunch members of . While they never discuss it at work, Mary deeply resents the views Bob posts on social media.
I'm assuming Bob and Mary are members of opposing political parties?
Even if that is not the case, is it really mandatory to friend/follow co-workers' stream of consciousness on social media?
Wouldn't it be more productive (from Mary's perspective) to segment professional from personal views by not actively following someone who's personal views she has disagreed with in the past, to keep all future interactions focused on work-related topics?
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#95I was so Alice for much of my career. I know this is going to sound totally cliche because this book get's recommended everywhere, but How to Win Friends and Influence People really did help me.
I prefer working with "Alices". It's refreshing to see people actually called on their bullshit. IMHO there's also a limit to how much you can spare everybody's feelings and still be effective at that ^^. I think the OP believed that there isn't a limit. I think he's wrong. In a corporate environment, there's almost no value in actually being one though. Linus Torvalds would almost never be promoted and would frequen…
Do you like the act, or the result?
That is, do you like "seeing people actually called on their BS"? Or, do you like people stop doing BS things as a result?
IMO, the latter is much more interesting than the former. Being a 100% Alice guarantees the former, but does not guarantee the latter.
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#96I've never actually come across an actually brilliant engineering person who was also a jerk. Maybe they sometimes superficially seemed like a jerk at first (particularly if you had a very thin skin), but not after you actually made an effort to get to know them. Most of the time though, the jerks just aren't even close to being brilliant. I feel this jerk attitude is quite often something that is used to mask inepti…
I experienced two nearly-brilliant thorough-going jerks at once in one role, who induced me and most of my peers to leave also. There have been a couple of others in another role, in banking, and they know exactly what I think of them! B^> These people do exist, and can be successful, and the description given in TFA pretty closely matches many aspects of psychopathy, such as the charming-when-necessary and no empath…
You mention banking. To me that's like a culturally totally separate universe, with totally separate profiles of people.
I don't think my experience applies to that universe.
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#97I am an Alice and I need some feedback as why is it a bad thing! I work in an environment when very small percentage of people know what are they doing. and people that know what is going on do not speak up because they are frustrated and know probably nothing will change. in this environment I do speak up whenever I get a chance and I've been in arguments with managers 3 4 level above me. everybody else wants to be…
There's research in neuroscience and psychiatry that conclude humans do not make decisions based upon hard facts.
Whether it's due to our culture or a human truism regardless isn't understood.
Just presenting a spreadsheet full of red and saying "We're screwing the pooch." makes me people uneasy. It doesn't give them context, which I think is the key.
People want to feel they have a rounded understanding. Standing on a soap box blasting off about your personal pet peeves is annoying.
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#98I am an Alice and I need some feedback as why is it a bad thing! I work in an environment when very small percentage of people know what are they doing. and people that know what is going on do not speak up because they are frustrated and know probably nothing will change. in this environment I do speak up whenever I get a chance and I've been in arguments with managers 3 4 level above me. everybody else wants to be…
> PS: where I currently work is wasting public money and I feel obligated to do something as a Libertarian!
do non-libertarians feel that there's nothing wrong with companies wasting taxpayer money?
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#99I am an Alice and I need some feedback as why is it a bad thing! I work in an environment when very small percentage of people know what are they doing. and people that know what is going on do not speak up because they are frustrated and know probably nothing will change. in this environment I do speak up whenever I get a chance and I've been in arguments with managers 3 4 level above me. everybody else wants to be…
[deleted]
Re: Brilliant Jerks in Engineering
#100I've never actually come across an actually brilliant engineering person who was also a jerk. Maybe they sometimes superficially seemed like a jerk at first (particularly if you had a very thin skin), but not after you actually made an effort to get to know them. Most of the time though, the jerks just aren't even close to being brilliant. I feel this jerk attitude is quite often something that is used to mask inepti…
I've met the brilliant jerk (and depending on who you ask, I've been the brilliant jerk). It's a real thing. One surprising thing is that it is possible for people to change, at least in how they treat people. Once I was told I would have to interact with the "brilliant jerk" and I complained and my manager said, "no, really, he has CHANGED" and, miracle of miracles, he had. I wish I knew exactly how and why he chang…
Amen and kudos for mentioning clinical depression as a thing that causes extreme irritability.
I know a few Bobs. They are hard to deal with. They get promoted. And eventually you might want to trade them out for a different Bob - which can mean just flat out leaving an organization. They aren't likely to go, so that means it's you.